00;00;00;00 - 00;00;32;23
Rob Lee
Welcome to the truth in this art, your source for conversations connecting arts, culture, and community. These are stories that matter, and I am your host, Rob Lee. Today I'm excited to be running it back with my next guest, the editor in chief of Up magazine. Up is a NYC based magazine that centers on street art, graffiti, and creative urban culture.
00;00;33;00 - 00;00;46;01
Rob Lee
We first spoke back in 2023 about street art, writing, and building platforms that document culture from the ground up. So I'm excited to welcome back to the program. TK Mills, welcome back to the podcast.
00;00;46;03 - 00;00;49;26
TK Mills
Yeah, man, it's a pleasure to be back. Good to be chat with you again, man.
00;00;49;28 - 00;00;59;21
Rob Lee
Absolutely. And I and I have to remark is, you know, we're on, the video, you know, you've got a great head of hair. Do you like. It's it's it is strong.
00;00;59;24 - 00;01;11;22
TK Mills
Appreciate it. Thank you. I'm, I have recently started going a little gray. Not as much up top, but in the beard. But, you know, I'm okay. Because I feel like it'll give me sort of, distinguished professor kind of look and the.
00;01;11;22 - 00;01;13;08
Rob Lee
Read records of it all.
00;01;13;11 - 00;01;13;21
TK Mills
Yeah.
00;01;15;07 - 00;01;23;23
Rob Lee
I feel like we're in the same, like, age bracket, maybe because, I, I see a few. I try to shave my hair, but I see a few popping out. I hit 40 back in January.
00;01;23;23 - 00;01;25;23
TK Mills
And I'm like,
00;01;25;26 - 00;01;30;22
Rob Lee
Let's see here. This is where we're at. This is what's coming. And even if I'm bald, it's like, here's one hair and it's great.
00;01;30;24 - 00;01;33;21
TK Mills
So what happens, man? And also, happy belated thank you.
00;01;33;27 - 00;01;56;05
Rob Lee
Thank you. So we last spoke back in 2023 is what I'm seeing here. And, you know, up mag has hit, a milestone and there's some big numbers and so on. But before we get into that, I would love it for you to introduce yourself, reintroduce yourself to the folks that shamefully missed that first interview.
00;01;56;05 - 00;02;02;13
Rob Lee
And they should tap in. But, reintroduce yourself and tell us about the magazine and sort of the milestone, please.
00;02;02;24 - 00;02;35;00
TK Mills
Yeah. For sure, man. So, yeah, my name is T.K. Mills. I'm the editor in chief of Up magazine, which is a New York City based, street art and graffiti magazine. That Myles soon you referred to was, just two months ago, we hit our, six year anniversary. And, yeah, it's it's really grown. Kind of came about as sort of, just an idea with a couple of friends to growing into my full time thing that I'm still out here hustling for every day, every way.
00;02;35;01 - 00;02;36;15
TK Mills
So, yeah.
00;02;36;18 - 00;02;46;15
Rob Lee
I love it. And it's, it's it's funny, I'd be remiss if I don't mention that. It's just really time stamp it. Today is actually the sixth anniversary of this podcast as well.
00;02;46;15 - 00;02;48;26
TK Mills
Oh, wow. Well, congratulations to you, man.
00;02;48;27 - 00;02;49;07
Rob Lee
Thank you.
00;02;49;09 - 00;02;52;18
TK Mills
Thank you to be here for the anniversary. Wow. That's cool.
00;02;53;21 - 00;03;12;01
Rob Lee
And so in it, as I think about anniversaries and thinking about where I was at six years ago, and I imagine you have been thinking about that and you know, doing, you know, up as long as you have. What are some of the biggest shifts that you've seen in the mission and the audience from when you started to to now totally.
00;03;12;01 - 00;03;32;18
TK Mills
So, I would say, you know, kind of two ends to that, to the mission and to the audience. I'll start kind of with the audience. I think our audience has grown a lot. You know, when we started, just by virtue of being a small team, we were a lot more in New York focused, versus now we've got writers contributing from around the world.
00;03;32;18 - 00;03;53;04
TK Mills
We got people in Berlin. I just talked to a guy before this about coming on for Vancouver. We got people in Spain. We've even had submissions in from, like, places like, you know, Southeast Asia. And with that, the audience has grown and grown, too. You know, with our website, we get a very global traffic stream of people from all over.
00;03;53;04 - 00;04;12;15
TK Mills
And that's that's really cool and exciting. You know, one of the things I love is, the op mag site we run through WordPress and, you can see, you know, where people come from and also how many people visit. And, you know, when we first start out, our first year, I think we got some like 8000 people total.
00;04;12;17 - 00;04;41;16
TK Mills
And now that's like a day or two for us. And that's that's really exciting to see. To see that kind of growth in terms of the mission, I would say we're still kind of true to the sort of the core tenants. You know, a big part of why we started was to shine a light somewhere to with, you know, up and coming and mid tier artists and, you know, because one of the reasons I started up was I really love street graffiti, but it was hard to find anything out because of the bigger magazines.
00;04;41;16 - 00;05;03;03
TK Mills
We're only doing stories on, you know, Banksy, Shepard Fairey who incredible artist. But you know, they don't need the press. Everyone knows them already. And so we want to be able to, kind of, you know, show people the ones who are going to be the artist people are talking about in the future. In terms of the mission shift, one of the things that's really grown for us is doing a lot more events.
00;05;03;16 - 00;05;28;01
TK Mills
Got a pretty solid event schedule where we typically do 4 to 5 a month, one almost every week. We work really closely of sour mouths, which is, kind of bar, nightclub, lounge and Lower East Side, where we put on events. There are art battle Tournament, which has been going on for five years. And more recently our Live Lounge series, which is a mix of live painting and live music.
00;05;28;10 - 00;05;46;19
TK Mills
We've been doing that for the past couple months, as well as the Buren over in Bushwick. We've been doing, sort of, we call it the neighborhood Art series, where we kind of showcase for up and coming artists in a cafe setting. It's a really good time. And then, yeah, just doing a lot of events, you know, everywhere and anywhere.
00;05;48;12 - 00;06;07;21
TK Mills
I try and keep an open mind and, you know, as we've kind of grown, more and more people sort of reach out to me to get up involved, which, I'm always open to considering the possibilities. But even the fact that people are kind of coming to us and, you know, sometimes they're like, hey, we just want to involved because people respect the brand name is is cool.
00;06;07;21 - 00;06;24;12
TK Mills
That's like, that's a milestone in of itself. But yeah. So, you know, I like to say we say, I like to say we stay true to sort of our roots, but we've grown with it. You know, we went from, bush to a tree and I got a bigger tree, maybe a forest one day. Who knows?
00;06;24;14 - 00;06;42;22
Rob Lee
But the forest idea, I think I went from, like, you know, like a few specks of dirt to maybe something a little bit, maybe. Maybe a little mole hill. Maybe, Oh, yeah. Yeah. So you mentioned a second ago, sort of those, those bigger magazines. So I'm curious. No, I don't think I had a chance to ask this previously.
00;06;42;25 - 00;06;56;01
Rob Lee
How or where does sort of mainstream media often, like, missed the mark on covering street art or having like, discourse around street art like and how does up approach it differently?
00;06;56;03 - 00;07;24;01
TK Mills
So yeah, I would say, there are you know, mainstream media is really broad term, right? Because there's the bigger art publications and then there's like, you know, CNN, Fox or something when a art story gets big enough to get their attention. Well, I'd say one of the most common things that people outside of the community is, you know, just, using graffiti and street art synonymously, they are very distinct subcultures.
00;07;24;01 - 00;07;46;25
TK Mills
And, you know, while they're related, they're very much their own worlds. But I would say more broadly, one of the things that we do have up is we really try and go in depth like we do, like a lot of artist profiles, it's kind of the bread and butter of our content, really talking to artists and getting their story of where they came from and how they've grown, versus like, you know, and I'm friends of some of the editors, so I don't want to brag on anyone.
00;07;46;26 - 00;08;04;03
TK Mills
Another publication. But like a lot of times, you know, when they sort of address street art or graffiti, it's like a lot more surface level. You know, just kind of this person painted this and it's like, cool, but, like, why do they paint that? Why? They're, you know, like, we like to kind of get, yeah.
00;08;04;03 - 00;08;10;03
TK Mills
Like a little bit more depth to it. You know, that was like one of our founding principles and something we've kind of stuck with.
00;08;10;05 - 00;08;26;19
Rob Lee
Yeah. And that that relates, and I definitely connect on sort of there are things that are similar, like when I think of podcasting, people, oh, it's just a radio show or it's, because video such a big thing. Now let's like the same thing, like, no, you're you're starting across streams. You know, those are, you know, slightly different.
00;08;26;19 - 00;08;49;23
Rob Lee
They have similarities. There depends on what the intent is. You know, you could be very journalistic with how you do your podcast. You could just be shooting it, shooting the breeze, you know, barbershop style. Or you could just say, look, I'm doing a video and all of those could overlap, but it could all be very, very different. And, you know, I've recognized that in doing education for the last two years and teaching, and I'm like, let me go back.
00;08;49;23 - 00;09;23;27
Rob Lee
What are some of my old ideas on what podcasting is or what this area is with this conversation? Looks like what remains true and what's what's different. And that only comes with doing something at a certain pace or in a certain way, for a certain amount of years, to really legislate where you're at, because things that I would imagine have shifted and that's as you you've you've touched on a bit there, there is a, a spot that you come from and, you know, sort of what the mission is and what the foundation is, but really being able to, again, with the trees branch out a bit.
00;09;24;00 - 00;09;44;05
TK Mills
Yeah. But not for. Yeah. Well, I want to give you that, man. I, I do think, you know, I've been on a couple podcasts now and one of the things I really love about what you got going on is, you know, you really do kind of dive in. Really well thought out questions. Whereas I've been on somewhere kind of shooting the shit, you know, some of those that have been on, I'm always like, who wants to hear this?
00;09;44;05 - 00;09;52;13
TK Mills
Like, I'm not like that. That's a my honest thoughts. I'm like, I guess there is an audience, but I don't know. That's that's just me.
00;09;52;16 - 00;10;16;22
Rob Lee
So thank you. I it's, it's funny like, you know, there there have been times we've missed each other, each time I've been in New York in the last few. Yeah. And, you know, that's actually the time where we shoot it, you know what I mean? Where. Yeah, yeah. And doing this like, I'm very curious about how you do what you do and really get into the in-depth component of it, which which brings me to this, this sort of next question you mentioned earlier the events schedule.
00;10;16;22 - 00;10;27;07
Rob Lee
So what sparked that idea? And like, what's been the sort of response to it? It's I would imagine folks are coming out, pull it up. But what's that bet because it's community. That's what I'm hearing totally.
00;10;27;10 - 00;10;48;15
TK Mills
Well, and I think that's a big part of it is like a big part of why we did up was for me, it I mean, for me personally, a big part of the reason I got into the art realm entirely was for the community. I mean, I kind of came from like a political background and, you know, a big reason not to go into that tangent, but like a big reason I kind of left it was it was just I just like, look, I was like, oh, you're not my people, you know?
00;10;48;15 - 00;11;09;12
TK Mills
Versus when I kind of came into the art world, I was like a lot more like, oh, these are people I enjoy and feel comfortable hanging out with. But why? We kind of gotten to events. It's sort of twofold, you know, a big part of it is, is Covid. Originally when we started up, we were doing, you know, a quarterly, quarterly release schedule.
00;11;09;15 - 00;11;28;25
TK Mills
Covid through all that out the window to now with our print, we shifted to, you know, just one a year, which has been good for us because it's also a lot more of, tangible and feasible schedule to stick to. And, you know, also, I think makes each release a little bit more special. It's like, hey, that's the big one of the year.
00;11;29;13 - 00;11;48;05
TK Mills
But, you know, a year is a long time and people forget you. So part of it was like in a way of like, us staying relevant. And part of it honestly was, financial necessity during Covid, you know, a lot of things that I was doing as sort of freelancing for side money, dried up.
00;11;48;07 - 00;12;15;11
TK Mills
And so, you know, once we kind of got the go ahead with vaccines to start doing stuff, we started working off a couple bars and places as just a way to, like, bring in revenue to kind of keep things alive. And then, you know, as we kind of gained our audience on the event side, it became sort of synergistic, where it's like people who found us through our events would go on to like, read the magazine, and people who were reading the magazine were like coming out to our events to meet other people in the community and, you know, see what's up.
00;12;15;14 - 00;12;40;24
TK Mills
And so, yeah, it really kind of took on a life of its own. And, you know, it's one of those things with me, too. It's like as this is the thing that I spend every day thinking about. It's just fun to do something different. While I love kind of sitting in my editor's chair and, you know, reading over stories, it's also fun to be able to put on an event and get to hang out people in real life, you know, have a drink and, you know, just connect.
00;12;40;26 - 00;13;14;08
Rob Lee
Totally. I, you know, I love that when, you know, when I had the opportunity to do some movie nights. Right. Just an opportunity for folks to get together. I like movies, come and chat with me about some of these goofy movies and hear me make it out myself. You know, the intent was that. And even going back and doing this, this season, I wanted to initially do only folks that had been on a podcast before and really flesh out the 100 episodes, and that idea shifted a bit and I was like, all right, let's still have that commitment to checking in with folks.
00;13;14;08 - 00;13;44;10
Rob Lee
Some folks were on in 2019, some folks were on last year, but really catching up with people. But, you know, also the big piece of it was there is a community that's built here. There is an archive here. There is a database here, if you will. So really in some ways feeding that in some ways, maintaining those relationships and building upon them, I look at this and I look at any of these sort of follow up conversations as a continuation of the first conversation, not a whole new thing.
00;13;45;11 - 00;13;49;24
Rob Lee
But and I mentioned they're sort of a database, so believe you have a database.
00;13;50;01 - 00;14;11;13
TK Mills
We do have a database. Yeah, that was something we launched a couple months ago. So we have our creatives database. And with that kind of the, the theory was, was again, you know, we're doing at minimum three events a month. And, it can be hard to curate that many artists. I mean, that's our Buren show is typically about 20 artists.
00;14;11;13 - 00;14;32;28
TK Mills
The art battles anywhere from 3 to 10. You know, the Live lounge and other six. I mean, we're looking at 40 artists a month, which is a lot to find people. Venue ously. And so they idea for the creatives database, too, was just a way to, open it up because, you know, people often try and submit to art to up and they're like, hey, how can I get involved?
00;14;32;28 - 00;14;49;01
TK Mills
How can I get involved? And this was sort of just a way to sort of streamline the process so that, you know, with all the events we're doing, I could bring in new faces. It's not, you know, I'm not I try not to online, but I know a lot of curators, particularly here in New York, where they've got their set, they've got their 510 artists that they do everything with.
00;14;49;01 - 00;15;11;21
TK Mills
And, you know, the I definitely have my people that like when the time calls for it, I call upon. But I'm always trying to bring in new people. I think it's just it makes things more engaging. It's more fun for me to meet new faces, meet new artists, see new styles. And so it was just kind of a way to open up the door for people to kind of get involved with us and just have things a little bit more organized.
00;15;11;21 - 00;15;34;05
TK Mills
You know, we would get DMs all the time, like, this looks so cool. Can I be in the next one? And just like a way to sort of have people. So basically sign up, we've got kind of like a Google Sheet that is sort of just like the onboarding thing where, you know, you say what kind of events are into, you know, a little bit about your style, a little about your resume, your portfolio, and you link it.
00;15;34;07 - 00;15;50;13
TK Mills
And then whenever we've got a new event, I'll go through and be like, oh, so-and-so, you know, Rob hasn't been in it. Let's let's go check out of his stuff. Oh, I think this would be a great fit for this event. We got an anime themed month. Oh, we're going to do this guy does anime art, you know, just as a way to sort of yeah, broaden our horizons a bit.
00;15;50;16 - 00;16;14;21
TK Mills
And then that two kind of becomes, you know, the way that we kind of work people up. Because with a lot of what we do with the events and the editorial is oftentimes, you know, with artists who we're looking for, the editorial, I want to get to know them a little bit first one, because it makes the capacity to sort of interview them a little bit easier of knowing some of their background, but also just knowing that, like, you know, they've they've got the chops.
00;16;14;21 - 00;16;29;22
TK Mills
And so, you know, oftentimes I kind of put people in one event if, if they're solid, I'll put them in a bigger event. And then, you know, we kind of build a rapport. I'll be like, all right, you know, this is someone I think that it's worth us doing a story on, because I've learned enough about them, what they're doing.
00;16;29;24 - 00;16;44;22
TK Mills
And, also, you know, kind of, again, on the financial side where we're working more and more with, sponsored events and trying to get that in. And for me, it's, you know, important to be able to kind of pay out artists and to do that. You know, it's one thing is with just an event for fun, the community.
00;16;44;22 - 00;16;59;27
TK Mills
But it's another thing when you know, so and so. Brand has put money on the line. I have to know that the people I'm bringing in are solid. And so it's a way to kind of, yeah, I don't want to say test people out, but, a way to kind of give them their foot in the door and prove themselves.
00;16;59;29 - 00;17;22;20
Rob Lee
That it makes sense. Like, you know, it's I'm thinking again, through this, any of these projects that I do, like I mentioned, the movie night earlier or the series of movie nights and that year that I was doing those, I did one every month. And I'm going through folks that have been on the podcast, I have rapport with them, doesn't work, and I reach out, there's budget attached and all of that stuff.
00;17;22;27 - 00;17;23;19
TK Mills
Vibe. Yeah.
00;17;23;27 - 00;17;39;20
Rob Lee
Do they fit within the theme of of what we're doing? So, you know, you may appreciate this. One that comes to mind is I did a movie night on, Head of state, the Chris Rock movie. Oh, yeah. And I had a political strategist who had been on a podcast come and shoot the breeze with me, and.
00;17;39;20 - 00;17;40;18
TK Mills
That's cool, man.
00;17;40;18 - 00;18;07;01
Rob Lee
Yeah, I love that. It was it was really, really cool. Or, you know, and that's I think that's important. You you reach into the network that you're, you're building now, this sort of database that you're, you're building out and like figure out where not to put your chess pieces per se, because people are not pawns. But, you know, just where folks could fit in, how to really feed and serve the network that's around your universe.
00;18;07;01 - 00;18;08;00
Rob Lee
I think that.
00;18;08;02 - 00;18;27;29
TK Mills
Building thing strategically, you know, I think that's sort of a key thing for anyone is just, you know, using the chess metaphor, just thinking, couple moves ahead and just as a way to like, yeah, kind of like, you know, I often say it's like every piece, their place, every person, their play is kind of thing where it's like, you know, there's not everyone's going to fit into everything.
00;18;27;29 - 00;18;37;22
TK Mills
That's part of what makes people are unique is that, you know, there's different styles for different vibes and so on and so forth. But yeah.
00;18;37;24 - 00;19;03;10
Rob Lee
That and that's important thing too, like when, when people fit where they're at like or where where people can fit in a specific spot, it takes sort of strategy. It takes vision. And I think you and I are sort of on a similar page when it comes to that, like when it comes to volume, when it comes to doing all of these, these different things and having, you know, bringing folks in, you like, for me, I don't want to waste people's time, you know, hey, come on in and shoot the breeze with me.
00;19;03;10 - 00;19;28;14
Rob Lee
And, you know, it's no merit, there's no energy. But I find, like, when there's an opportunity presented for for me or opportunities, I guess what I would like is the way that I approach folks to be approached in that same way, to be one of those people of the favorites or the folks that are like mentioned. It's like, hey, you could think of me, I do these things, bring bring me in.
00;19;28;14 - 00;19;58;12
Rob Lee
And I get it. Folks have their favorites. And I think what I'm getting at is we are all especially when we're strategic or we're on the hustle. We all have. We're all busy, but we all can make time for these things that are interesting. Give you an example. The Sunday nights this past Sunday, I was part of a TV web series, and, basically, I'm just being profiled through the movies that I like, and it was something they got moved around a few times.
00;19;58;12 - 00;20;15;12
Rob Lee
I usually don't do things on the weekends, but I was like, let's do this. What's the timing? Just a couple of hours. And I was really cool just to come on and be me and just talk about things that I love. And I'm giving, you know, these folks some sort of content. And it felt like really like a good relationship that fit, that worked.
00;20;15;14 - 00;20;34;04
Rob Lee
So that's a win when it comes to the the minimal amount of time that I have to put towards these things. Now, for someone like you, you're involved in so many projects. You get interviews, you get pilots, you get a vent. So, you know, talk more about some of these things that are keeping you busy. Specifically, I saw a TV pilot.
00;20;34;06 - 00;20;51;28
TK Mills
Yeah, man. So that's that's one of the things that I'm most excited for. So it's an idea that had kind of been kicking around for, a long time, but I always loved kind of like the Anthony Bourdain Parts and on that kind of travel series and, you know, big my first love before street art was traveling.
00;20;51;28 - 00;21;09;08
TK Mills
You know, I had the privilege to backpack a lot in my early 20s, you know, couch surfing and seeing new places. And one of the things that I loved just how with street art, that is part of the community, you know, it's common for artists to travel city to city for festivals. You know, you make friends and they're like, hey, I got a wall for you.
00;21;09;09 - 00;21;29;13
TK Mills
Come by Berlin. Yeah, we'll paint together. And so, I just friend of a friend, you know, those kind of Brooklyn community connections. I met this guy, Spencer Brandler. And we just kind of chop it up at a birthday party, and, you know, he mentioned he was, worked in TV. He had, it's prolific cameraman.
00;21;29;13 - 00;21;45;06
TK Mills
It was kind of getting his foot into directing, and I kind of brought up the idea, and I was like, oh, you know, I always like the idea of, why don't you, like a travel street art show? And he's like, that's cool. That's a good idea. We should. Yeah, we should do that. And yeah, first I was because I wasn't sure if we to sort of like, hey, yeah, we should do that.
00;21;45;08 - 00;22;03;10
TK Mills
But, you know, I give Spencer the credit. He was serious, but he followed up with me. And then, you know, for a couple months, we started brainstorm him putting it together, and then it kind of came to fruition. A couple months ago, we actually got into the filming and, filmed the pilot. We're still kind of working through the editing of it.
00;22;03;21 - 00;22;19;09
TK Mills
But the goal is that essentially, once we've got the pilot edited in together, we're going to take it to a couple different networks. We have some ins with the some of the big names and streaming and, you know, hopefully, at the very least, they give it a watch, even if they, don't say yes, you know, once you get it.
00;22;19;09 - 00;22;41;10
TK Mills
But they don't. That's all you can hope for. But, yeah, the concept for the show, tentatively titled, urban Art Odyssey, is it's essentially the sort of soft pitch I give people is like, it's and they Bourdain's parts unknown. But instead of, travel and food, it's travel and street art. And so, yeah, it was cool.
00;22;41;10 - 00;23;01;12
TK Mills
And then. Yeah, for the pilot, we kind of did it focused really around Bushwick. We had done the, Bushwick Block Party as part of it, talking to artists from all over who had kind of come for it, as well as a few locals and kind of got their input. But it was really fun. And, you know, I'm not I'm usually more of a behind the scenes guy, not as much of, in front of the camera kind of thing.
00;23;01;12 - 00;23;28;04
TK Mills
But for this, I'm, you know, the tentative host. And I actually found that I liked it a lot more than I thought I would. And being on a set with, you know, camera crew was something I found kind of exciting. So, yeah, that's one of the things that I'm really looking forward to. I think it has the potential to kind of elevate up to the next level, you know, bring us from a whole new audience and just yeah, it kind of connects my different passions of meeting people, talking to people, traveling and street art.
00;23;28;04 - 00;23;42;25
TK Mills
And so, I'm optimistic. I think it's cool. But yeah, it's, even earlier today before, you know, getting on here with you, I was going through some of the transcripts and just watching the footage, and, it looks great. So I'm. I'm excited to get it going.
00;23;42;28 - 00;24;08;12
Rob Lee
That sounds amazing. It's funny, like, when I can see something and this is, again, one of those things, I think we overlap. When I see something, I feel like I've had an experience. I feel like, So I want to say about a year ago, be a year in September, I ended up going to, Columbus, for this, event called Cartoon Crossroads on the CCK.
00;24;08;15 - 00;24;27;05
Rob Lee
And, I was connected through folks that I've interviewed before. It was a through line. It was like, oh, yeah, the folks that I interviewed at, Small Press Expo in Bethesda, Maryland, they'd asked me, could you come here and do a panel and interview some folks for a panel on the intersection of arts, comics, and social justice?
00;24;27;05 - 00;24;45;00
Rob Lee
And I was like, should I do that? Yes, a little bit. Did that met some people. And sort of being in this network, in this community of like sort of the folks that were there visiting, but all into this larger community of, sort of indie artists, indie comic artists. And I did my sort of podcast hosting thing that some people.
00;24;45;03 - 00;25;03;00
Rob Lee
And then I kind of just kicked it in and kind of got a get dipped in Columbus and then, you know, went to the after party for the event and all that. And I say all of this to say that it felt like it was an episode of like, any Bourdain esque thing. So in those instances, there's only been two instances, really.
00;25;03;00 - 00;25;10;25
Rob Lee
That's the first. And the second one actually was in New York. I was, in L.A., so I was that you probably know I was at Beverly's.
00;25;10;27 - 00;25;13;03
TK Mills
Okay. Yeah, I think, I think you're talking about. Yeah.
00;25;13;05 - 00;25;37;22
Rob Lee
And I was there with some of my buddies, and we were just kind of like, hanging out. And one of my buddies, had, was showing work, and I was like, oh, this is another version of this thing of this TV show that I just haven't worked on yet. Yeah. So I just feel like it's there. But when you see it and I too am a person that prefers to kind of be behind the scene or as I call a protective screen and Wi-Fi, to be away from people.
00;25;37;24 - 00;25;50;19
Rob Lee
But when you have the crew behind you and they trust and they're just like, hey, we're going to follow you and we're going to edit, you know, you're relinquishing something and it feels good to not have to do everything, I suppose.
00;25;50;21 - 00;26;08;15
TK Mills
Oh, do that. That's such a good point, because that was actually one of the things with Spencer was our, director and I'm so used to being the guy that puts it all together and who everything sort of relies on. Just getting told what to do was, like, weirdly refreshing to just be just like, oh, run it back this way.
00;26;08;15 - 00;26;22;18
TK Mills
I do that. So I'm like, wow, yeah, whatever you say, man, you're the boss. It's it's kind of nice. As someone who's been, you know, freelancing for forever and running up, it's just like, oh, it's kind of cool to sort of. Yeah, let someone else take the wheel for a minute.
00;26;22;20 - 00;26;41;02
Rob Lee
Yes. And before I move to the next question is last thing I'll see in that vein, I, I did like my first, like, legit photo shoot a few months back and it was, I guess had been on the pod. I really liked his work. And then he was like, let's return the favor. Not that fake thing that people say of, hey man, whenever you need something.
00;26;41;02 - 00;27;03;02
Rob Lee
And is it they don't mean that? He was like, no, come to the studio, bring a couple of fits. And I was like, sure. And I did it. And I'm very much like, you know, when you run stuff, you're strategic and all. You're like, all right, cool. And I was like, relinquish. And he really captured me and everything came through by seeing him operator's process, but already haven't talked to him about his process.
00;27;03;04 - 00;27;11;18
Rob Lee
And it was funny. He was joking about it. He was like, I feel like we've developed the shorthand in this hour or two hour session that we know each other at a whole different level now.
00;27;11;21 - 00;27;29;08
TK Mills
Yeah, well, it's true, I think when you kind of work with someone, it builds a bond that, Yeah. I don't know, like collaboration is the, the key to so many things. Friendships and just yet building and developing relationships. Yeah.
00;27;29;10 - 00;27;34;21
Rob Lee
So one of the other things I saw recently, you were featured in my Modern Met this year.
00;27;34;23 - 00;27;53;10
TK Mills
Yeah, that was cool. That was actually, on the no building relationship. So I was in Miami, Art Basel last year and, you know, just doing the Basel thing, kind of bumping around. And, I met this artist, Shane Brammer, and, one of his friends, this guy Eugene Kim, really good guy. And, you know, you just kind of exposed.
00;27;53;10 - 00;28;08;25
TK Mills
Yeah. What do you do? And he's like, oh, I run a magazine. I was like, I also run a magazine. So I got really excited. Yeah. We were just kind of swapping war stories about what it is. I mean, he's been doing this a lot longer than me and my mother met. They've been around, I think like 17, 18 years.
00;28;08;25 - 00;28;27;26
TK Mills
We actually did a story of them as well. And it wasn't so much a tit for tat so much as I wanted to, you know, similar like. Oh, thank you for interviewing me. I'd love to interview you. But, you know, it was just cool because, like, yeah, I'm so used to being the one asking questions.
00;28;27;26 - 00;28;55;05
TK Mills
It's nice to be asked questions. Yeah. Same for you, man. It's it's like, it's kind of cool being on the other side, but yeah, it was exciting. They are a really prolific magazine. I mean, they're art based, but it's not just art. It's like art, culture, science. But they. Yeah, they've been around forever. He was telling me that, you know, they part of the way they got their start was, when stumble upon, you know, was bat a thing back in the day, you could find random websites by the click.
00;28;55;05 - 00;29;10;25
TK Mills
Yeah. You and I are of the age group. We remember that kids these days probably don't. But I thought that was super cool. And. Yeah, so it was an honor to, to get interviewed and share a little bit about you know, how up and came to be in you know, how I find myself in this crazy little community.
00;29;10;25 - 00;29;12;02
TK Mills
So, yeah.
00;29;12;05 - 00;29;37;12
Rob Lee
Yeah. Like, I like when those opportunities present themselves. And I always sort of seek them out, like, you know, it's not I think it's in a realm where you have to really, really, really be out there almost shamefully self-promoting yourself. And if that's what you're doing, your lane is to help elevate others and elevate other's work, and maybe using sort of your platform or your publication to to make that happen.
00;29;37;18 - 00;29;57;14
Rob Lee
That's a piece of it. But it doesn't necessarily mean that when I'm looking at, it just like I see HTC's face just covering it like, yo, what are we doing? Like, and I do the same thing with this. Like, you know, when an opportunity comes up and someone wants to cover me or wants to interview me or talk about this work, it's great.
00;29;58;02 - 00;30;19;18
Rob Lee
Especially podcast appearances and so on. Those are the things that matter. And I am trying to get better at being in some of those rooms for those opportunities to, to take place. Because, you know, I know how to talk to people. And, you know, as I was sharing like earlier, when I was in New York for, for spring break and being able to connect with people literally.
00;30;19;20 - 00;30;36;06
Rob Lee
And, you know, I mentioned to you that I was there for like 40 minutes or so and booking a bunch of interviews, but 30 of those 40 minutes, I probably just talked to an associate curator in one of the booths, and he was just like, man, he's like, you're famous, right? I was like, I am a nobody. I'm just here floating through life.
00;30;36;08 - 00;30;57;02
Rob Lee
And I'm told I shouldn't say that, you know, that I'm a nobody. But at the big scale, it's like I'm in New York. I don't really have a a footing and a connection there. But the more of those opportunities present themselves, it helps with that growth potential, that growth potentially. And it feels almost organic to as you touched on, it's not a tit for tat.
00;30;57;02 - 00;31;02;10
Rob Lee
It's sort of like I like what you do if you are cool coming on Mars, I would love to have you on.
00;31;02;13 - 00;31;23;21
TK Mills
Well it's funny, there's actually two thoughts on that that are interrelated to what you just said. So one of them was, Lonnie, who is one of the original founding members of had something. I was like, who is like everybody is somebody and everybody is nobody at the same time. So it's so true that, you know, especially in the graffiti world, some will be like, you know, I was king of the B line or something.
00;31;23;21 - 00;31;45;19
TK Mills
That's like, yeah, but like outside this initial community, no one knows who the fuck you are, you know? But within that community, you're you're a king. And I think that's like a good lesson in humility. It's like everyone's got their people in their audience. But, you know, in the grand scheme of things, who are we really? But the tangential thread was, Lonnie recently moved to Baltimore, and I had actually put you on his radar.
00;31;45;26 - 00;31;55;04
TK Mills
I've been wanting to do a little something about you for a minute, and, he was telling me once you settle in and he was planning to hit you up, so know, you know. Yeah.
00;31;55;25 - 00;31;56;29
Rob Lee
What's the connection?
00;31;57;02 - 00;32;19;04
TK Mills
Yeah. Dude, a lot of these, Lonnie is good people. It's funny too, because, like, and you kind of mentioned my face. I think that's one of the things about. That's. I think been a blessing and a curse. Is that people just associate me with it. And, you know, I'm the one who's at all the things. But it's I really got to give a shout out to the Up team because, yeah, they they are what make it what it is.
00;32;19;04 - 00;32;38;14
TK Mills
You know, I we started with four people and now we've got almost 30 active contributors and you know, probably in the grand scheme of people have kind of come and gone. We were probably almost at 100. I mean, we've had people write stories left and right and it's cool and it's it's like a legacy that I'm proud of that, you know, has been built upon.
00;32;38;14 - 00;32;41;04
TK Mills
So yeah, it's dope.
00;32;41;06 - 00;33;00;15
Rob Lee
It's got a couple more real questions that I want to run by you, and I want to go back a little bit. I'm seeing what this this rabble. I'm seeing that, and this sort of notion of, like, getting folks together, like, it's it's no small feat. And bringing folks together, like, you know, as they say, as the kids say, the vibes have to be, right.
00;33;00;17 - 00;33;01;04
TK Mills
Yeah.
00;33;01;06 - 00;33;23;20
Rob Lee
An event has to be marketed. Well, it needs to be Instagram with all of these other factors that go on. Or, you know, maybe I'm older, but that's what I'm told, that these are the factors that have to go into it. But for you, what are the key considerations when you're putting something together, when you're thinking through events, when you're thinking through sort of, you know, anything that you want to spend time with, let alone that brand equity toward.
00;33;23;22 - 00;33;43;02
TK Mills
Totally. So, you know, that there's kind of several components and, you know, I'll use Ravel as an example because you mentioned so Ravel Wine is a California based wine company that, invests a lot of their energy into being sustainable, which is something that I deeply respect, especially in a world where things are so throwaway. But.
00;33;43;02 - 00;34;02;19
TK Mills
So we worked with them as part of their Earth Day campaign to do sort of a New York activate, you know, raise brand awareness for rabble in the New York community. And so, you know, I, I was because it's almost similar of our issues, you know, each of our issues, print issues has a theme, and we kind of work backward from the theme to curate the art and articles.
00;34;02;19 - 00;34;25;10
TK Mills
It was kind of similar of the event where I was like, all right, you know, wine and sustainability, let's work from that. So, you know, first it was like, all right, what artists are going to put in the roster, artists who have a lot of organic or naturalistic elements, artists who, you know, are very they're passionate in sort of art activism with it or just, you know, really exemplify sort of those values.
00;34;25;12 - 00;34;55;01
TK Mills
And then, you know, it's like, okay, now that we got the art, that's an element. You know, a key part, cornerstone of any good event is the DJ reached out to, DJ damage, who is someone who works with us a lot, and he's just good at holding it down. And then just. Yeah, kind of putting in the different aspects of just like, you know, vibe is sort of an intangible thing, but, to make it work, you kind of just have to, yeah, put the right people together and it kind of flows organically.
00;34;55;15 - 00;35;18;10
TK Mills
But speak about events more broadly. This is something I talk to people a lot with, event fliers is, I see so many people that they work too hard on making sure the flier looks cool, that they kind of forget the essentials. I'm like, I always say, the five second rule if you've got an event and you got a flier, I should know the who, what, where, when and why within five seconds.
00;35;18;10 - 00;35;51;00
TK Mills
Looking at it, you know, like the biggest thing should really be like time, place, date, and what it is, you know, sometimes make people make fliers too cluttered, sometimes they make it too minimalistic. But it's like, I don't want to have to search for the information that's necessary for me to go to your event. And so that's, I think, something we've done really well, up in our design team is, you know, trying to give each of our fliers sort of a unique feel because I do love sort of, classic flier design events, like, you know, like rock posters or something.
00;35;52;24 - 00;36;01;21
TK Mills
But yeah, just like being able to use storytelling in, short, presentable way, you know?
00;36;01;23 - 00;36;27;05
Rob Lee
Yeah, that's that's good. I and I think, yeah, you know, there's all of these different things that go into to something. And I'm always very curious of the sort of the sort of piece where we don't do the slow burn. We we're trying to do something that it doesn't feel like it's serving the intended audience. And I like what you were saying there about, sort of a flier that, that, that sort of roll there, because I see myself doing that all the time.
00;36;27;05 - 00;36;47;18
Rob Lee
It's like kind of I kind of feel that that informational piece right there trying to get those vibes and artwork over. And I make those considerations, you know, myself and any of the stuff that I do, you know, I've updated some of my artwork. I got these new, cards that I have is these NFC cards that, leads directly to the website.
00;36;47;20 - 00;37;06;07
Rob Lee
But the intent in getting those and utilizing those is I find that paper cards are pretty disposable people. You know, they get damaged really easily. I hand it off to one of my buddies who's a comedian, and he was like, I feel like we're in an American Psycho bit right now. I was like, mean, you're just like, you're pulling out your card, right?
00;37;06;09 - 00;37;07;24
TK Mills
Yeah.
00;37;07;27 - 00;37;32;05
Rob Lee
And, you know, it was just an idea that I think to grow and to get across the thing that I'm trying to do, I have to be open and explore things that I'm not leading with vibes first and leading with this is going to be done. Well. I'm not going to have asset. So when I got the cards design, I found the right guy, did doesn't, and I hired one of my artist friends who did my most recent logo, and I said, can you do this?
00;37;32;05 - 00;37;50;28
Rob Lee
I can throw him some cash. Did it? It looks like a cassette tape has the NFC on there. It's it's slightly different colors. From my normal setup. It's something that sticks out into something that you can easily if is at a restaurant or a, or coffee shop where I've done that. They leave it right there at the register.
00;37;50;28 - 00;37;59;25
Rob Lee
They're like, yeah, let me hold your phone like a tap it on there to take you right to this guy's website. I was on his podium and people keep it in their wallet like it's a credit card.
00;37;59;27 - 00;38;16;11
TK Mills
That's cool man. Well, and it's funny, you you bring it up, with the idea of, like, you know, paper sometimes being disposable. I collect every business card I get. Especially the colons. I don't know what I'm going to do with it one day. I have, like, a couple art concepts in mind that I want to kind of play around with.
00;38;16;14 - 00;38;40;17
TK Mills
But I've collected so many, and I love it. And, you know, just as someone who likes physical, tangential things, I think having a card that kind of connects to the internet is such a great way of bringing the analog and the digital together. You know, it's finding that seamless connection because, you know, as everything has moved into the digital realm, I feel like it, it loses some of its value.
00;38;40;19 - 00;39;03;02
TK Mills
You know, when you're kind of competing with 20 million other things on someone's, you know, TikTok or whatever. And it's also it's just it's almost too accessible. First is when you have something in limited supply, limited quantity or whatever it is by nature, the scarcity of it adds a little something. And plus it's just nice to like, hold something great.
00;39;03;02 - 00;39;19;02
TK Mills
I'm obviously biased as someone who still runs a print magazine, but yeah, it's I think, yeah, I think finding a way to kind of bring those threads together because trying to go totally analog, you know, you're, you're going to be a dinosaur trying to go totally digital. You know, you're going to lose your footing.
00;39;19;04 - 00;39;40;07
Rob Lee
So yeah, I think, the thing that I was playing with was an amalgamation of what recently I talked about the sort of, you know, what is it, the digital analog loop. I wanted to do that. And taking something that purely is digital, that can easily get lost that you touched on. But I also I go a little bit more even negative with it that sometimes it can be considered disposable.
00;39;40;12 - 00;40;02;12
Rob Lee
And I don't want an archive like this to be disposable. So if I can put something in a person's hand and I'm thinking more and more of like that, bridging those two and finding those inflection points. So I got two more real questions. One kind of, you know, it's a real quick one. So I tend to find the obscure, culturally rich events naturally.
00;40;02;12 - 00;40;16;15
Rob Lee
It's just like I have good taste. I find the things and I'm like, there, whether it's in my hometown or whether it's in places I love New York, Philly, New Orleans. For you, what are some of the the early tolls that you're traveling? What are some of the early tools that an event is going to be worth you showing up?
00;40;16;15 - 00;40;22;06
Rob Lee
Like, you can look it up and it's like, man, this was this was a certain wait, wait,
00;40;22;17 - 00;40;45;23
TK Mills
I love to say I have an intuitive sense. I don't, but, you know, for me, it's like when I see an event, I, I'm kind of like, you know, it's a very New York thing. But there's always the question, where is it? You know, like, I've. I've gone to the Bronx for events and there's been great events, but, you know, for me to go to the Bronx, it's gotta be like, all right, this gotta be some wild, you know, like.
00;40;46;00 - 00;41;05;18
TK Mills
Because that for me is like a two hour commute. You know, and I'm, I know most New Yorkers feel the same. It's like even some of the stuff I do in Brooklyn, people like, but, that's, you know, but no, just in terms of, like, what is going to make something cool. I often kind of trust the, the circle I have.
00;41;05;18 - 00;41;24;28
TK Mills
I mean, I know my friends, I know my community, and I know who's got good taste and who's just kind of doing whatever. And so it's kind of like a little bit of like, oh, like so and so is, is on board, like, all right, I trust them. I'll check it out. But also sometimes there's wild cards like, you know, I'll just go to stuff just at a whim and see what's up.
00;41;25;01 - 00;41;54;11
TK Mills
I mean, there's actually an event I'm really excited for on Thursday, a buddy of mine runs the Bushwick Deli, which is, a local publication, and they apparently partnered with this, gladiator thing. It's not really art related. It's it's like live action gladiators where I don't really fully know what it is, but I'm incredibly intrigued. Like all of the ads are dudes, like, in full, like, like plating, you know, like like medieval knights just like chomping at each other.
00;41;54;11 - 00;42;08;17
TK Mills
And I'm like, I have to go to this. Like, I don't know what this is, but, like, I want to see what's up. So yeah, sometimes it's just curiosity. I'm just like, something I don't understand. And I'm like, I want to go so I can get what this is, you know?
00;42;08;20 - 00;42;29;19
Rob Lee
Yeah, I get, I believe, like, firmly that my taste is really strong. And, you know, the few people that I do get feedback from, you know, in that same vein, I like, okay, I trust your thing, but I, I find like it's a challenge to get people to go to things with you. When and so the last two times I was in, you know, New York, I stayed in L.A..
00;42;29;19 - 00;42;48;06
Rob Lee
Yes. One time I was in, February for On Air Fest. So I was like, between, you know, less and in Williamsburg, which I was like, oh, this is the thing they say about Williamsburg because I've never been there before. Yeah. And I was spending, what, I think $7 on cortado. So that's what I was so I don't per cortado.
00;42;48;08 - 00;43;07;22
Rob Lee
And the last time, it was May when I was up there for, for Art week, but I was hanging out with friends and kind of seeing them and getting sort of like, all this stuff is right here. And I had one interview at, Apollo Gallery, and, you know, all of that stuff is really good, but I was just, absorbing it and catching content.
00;43;07;22 - 00;43;22;21
Rob Lee
I was like, this is great. This is me, like, doing the tourist thing here. And, you know, getting sort of those invites and being able to decline and be a little bit more discerning as to where do I want to go for is it how many trains do I have to get on for this?
00;43;22;23 - 00;43;38;21
TK Mills
Totally. Well, and it's one of those things too, where it's like, you know, especially of art stuff. It's typically on Thursday nights. There's only so many Thursday nights in a month, you can only go to so many things. And, you know, you mentioned bringing friends stuff. I have actually a big proponent of just go and do stuff by yourself.
00;43;38;21 - 00;43;57;15
TK Mills
I do it a lot, and sometimes it's almost easier to meet and connect with people when you're solo. But it's also fun sometimes I roll through a friends in a group. But yeah, I don't know. I guess it's, it's a mix of kind of keeping an open mind and, not keeping it so open that your brain falls out, you know.
00;43;57;17 - 00;44;13;12
Rob Lee
And I dig it. So this is the last real question. And just more of, sort of the forecasting. What is the the biggest thing, in your opinion, on your horizon up to Ryzen? What's coming up for the rest of this year into next year?
00;44;13;14 - 00;44;32;05
TK Mills
Totally. So the biggest thing that I don't know if it's necessarily just to this year thing, but kind of an ongoing thing is the Art Odyssey pilot. We'll probably have that piece together within the next couple months, and then we're probably going to spend a couple months pitching. But that's on me putting a lot of my energy into,
00;44;32;08 - 00;44;56;09
TK Mills
The other big thing is this year's print that we've got tentatively slated for, October ber that's going to be issue seven, fashion design. And we've been working on that one for a minute. I'm really stoked on it. And then the other two things, beyond our kind of usual event and editorial calendars, I'm headed to France in September for, my buddy Enzo's and org's festival.
00;44;56;12 - 00;45;17;20
TK Mills
It's, it's a global street art festival that launched last year that I went to the inaugural, version of, and it was such a blast. And so I'm really excited for that. And then, another event that has recently kind of got looped into is, Showdown Chinatown, which is going to be happening also under September.
00;45;18;05 - 00;45;37;20
TK Mills
That's going to be sort of a cultural festival focusing on Asian American artists. And so I'm going to be doing some assistance, on the curating, but there's some massive walls that we've got to paint. And so that's really exciting for me because I've always want, I've curated a couple walls, but it's usually been on, commissioned basis.
00;45;37;23 - 00;46;01;13
TK Mills
And so, you know, this is theoretically open to whomever we want to bring in, you know, with a focus on kind of Asian artists. But I'm, I'm really excited for because, I mean, I know a lot of talented artists and just the capacity to, like, put people on walls, I think, be really fun. So those are the things that I'm kind of, the bigger, you know, milestones in the coming year.
00;46;01;26 - 00;46;22;25
TK Mills
But beyond that, yeah, we're going to keep it grindin. You know, we publish like typically 4 to 5 stories a week on the website. We got our weekly events that we're always pushing through and meeting people with. So yeah, I'm excited. 2025 is kind of flown by. It's sort of crazy. You were already past the halfway mark, but, I'm excited for the rest of it has in store.
00;46;22;28 - 00;46;31;28
Rob Lee
Nice. All right, so it sounds like good stuff. And, Yeah, looking forward to seeing some things I'll keep my eye out for, for, these issues that.
00;46;32;00 - 00;46;43;02
Unknown
No no no no no no no no no no no no.
00;46;43;05 - 00;47;03;04
Rob Lee
So between that I got two rapid fire questions for you. And you don't want to overthink those, you know, rapid fire ones. So we've mentioned two sort of big numbers, you know, just mentioned, you know, issue seven, and also sort of year six, the sort of celebration there. What is your favorite number or your lucky number?
00;47;03;06 - 00;47;17;06
TK Mills
I would say my favorite number is 57. It's really just because of the fact that when I played high school sports, that was the one that got assigned to me. And I just built an attachment, and I feel like five is a good number. Seven to the number 57.
00;47;17;09 - 00;47;19;26
Rob Lee
Great number for you play football.
00;47;20;07 - 00;47;22;29
TK Mills
Back in high school, not not any time recently.
00;47;23;01 - 00;47;26;02
Rob Lee
You have a you have a linebackers build. That's why I was just like.
00;47;26;04 - 00;47;28;08
TK Mills
Yeah.
00;47;28;26 - 00;47;32;10
Rob Lee
I did that, I wrote poetry, I was, I was the only.
00;47;32;12 - 00;47;45;17
TK Mills
I did football, I did hockey, hockey was really the main one. Football. I end up quitting. Coach was an asshole, and I just had enough of it one day, and I told them, go fuck themselves. But hockey was fun. Yeah.
00;47;45;19 - 00;48;08;13
Rob Lee
Here's the next and final one. And this is back to to, magazine. What is the one key to to growing up without losing that edge? And, and I say this because, you know, we see creators, we see all of these different entities. We like what they do. And then suddenly when you see, it's like, yeah, you know, it's I partner with whatever, whatever.
00;48;08;13 - 00;48;21;13
Rob Lee
And then the brain starts to get a little and I pride myself for my independence, for better or for worse. So it's in that vein. What is that sort of, you know, that one key to to growing while maintaining the edge?
00;48;21;16 - 00;48;40;17
TK Mills
Totally. And this is going to sound super cliche, but the answer really is community. I mean, I try and say and act member of the community. I still go to stuff. I mean, I respond to almost every email, text, DM we get, you know, even with just sometimes I'm saying no because people are just, like wanting something.
00;48;40;17 - 00;48;56;11
TK Mills
But, you know, I try and give them the courtesy of at least responding, because, you know, I do hope with up to, to sort of build out the financial end. I mean, we didn't really get into it too much, but I think up has always been community minded, and I am trying to sort of balance that on the business side.
00;48;57;02 - 00;49;13;16
TK Mills
You know, it wasn't optimized to be a business. And, you know, I don't really want to be optimized to be a business. That being said, I do need to make sure my right gets paid every month. So finding that kind of balance to things. But now I think it's like, you know, it's not even like the thing of like, oh, what does it mean to sell out?
00;49;13;16 - 00;49;32;23
TK Mills
And it's like, there's nothing wrong with working with brands, but it's like, but you got to work with as alignment on vision again, like rabble. I think sustainability is an incredibly important thing, especially in today's world. You know, that's something I'm more than happy to kind of work with someone on. So yeah, I would say keeping the community real, keeping authentic.
00;49;32;23 - 00;49;43;13
TK Mills
Don't just use it as a hashtag. You know, you've got to go out and mingle with your people and check in with them and make sure they're good and help them and they'll help you kind of thing. You know.
00;49;43;15 - 00;49;48;28
Rob Lee
And make sense and make sense. And, that's I think that's it. I think we got it. I think we got the majority of it.
00;49;49;18 - 00;50;04;01
TK Mills
It's it's been fun. It has been cool to see how we've both grown and hear a little bit from you. And I hope, your next new York trip, I can, you know, snag you for a drink or something. Oh, even I I'm hoping later this year to to get down the coast a bit. I'd love to go to Baltimore.
00;50;04;01 - 00;50;11;23
TK Mills
I haven't been in years. And yeah, especially now vlogging of you. It's like I, you know, it's getting to see the the Mid-Atlantic region. I think it would be a lot of fun. So.
00;50;12;00 - 00;50;22;20
Rob Lee
Oh yeah. Just just hit me up and I'll hit you up when I'm back in. And why? So in that, let the folks know where they can find you, find up and all that good stuff. The floor is yours. These final moments.
00;50;22;22 - 00;50;47;16
TK Mills
Totally. Yeah. So I would say, if you want to hit us up, our website is up. Mag comm. You pcmag.com. Check us out. We publish daily, and then on Instagram, it is just up underscore, underscore mag, and that's Instagram and that's really it. I think we got a Facebook. I never use it. I never use it.
00;50;47;16 - 00;50;56;06
TK Mills
One day I'll make a TikTok, but it's not today. But check out the website. Check out the IG. It's up mag. Yeah.
00;50;56;08 - 00;51;16;09
Rob Lee
And there you have it, folks. I want to again, thank TK Mills from Up magazine for coming back on to the podcast for for running it up and running it back. And for TK, I am probably saying that there's art, culture and community in and around your neck of the woods. You just have to look for it.