Music
Rob Lee: Welcome to the Truth in this Art, your source of conversations connecting arts, culture and community. These are stories that matter and I am your host, Rob Lee. Today I'm excited to be running it back with my next guest, a ceramic artist whose large-scale installations use repetition, labor and material intensity to explore themes of body, shelter and landscape. Raised in a creative household and soul and now based in the DMV, her work draws on cultural memory while pushing the boundaries of form and shape.
We last spoke back in 2023 and I'm excited to hear what's new in her studio and in her thinking. So please welcome back to the program, Aura Co. Welcome back to the podcast.
Thank you for coming back, Ara And this is a plus. This is one of those instances and I've been trying to do more of that in sort of this arc of interviews. We've done the interview. We met for coffee briefly. We did, yeah. And now we're in real life, so in a real life sort of interaction for the interviews. So for the folks who are undiped and shamefully didn't listen to our first interview, could you reintroduce yourself and tell us a bit about your work?
Ara Koh: Yeah. Hi. My name is Ara Koh. I'm a ceramic artist. It's kind of odd to say ceramic artist now. I'm an artist based off of ceramics and I do a lot of stuff with clay. I dig around places. I process clay, make paintings with it. I fire clay. I make stuff. I teach clay. So I'm a clay person.
Rob Lee: You're a clay person? Yeah. That might be the name of this interview.
Rob Lee: That sounds good, honestly. Thank you for that. I'm going to start doing my intros and folks ask me what I do since I do education and podcasting. Yeah. Yeah, I'm a POD person.
Ara Koh: Yeah, that sounds good. That sounds good.
Rob Lee: They're going to think I'm made out of peas because peas are in a POD.
Ara Koh: I know one time I was telling my friends that all my friends are clay people and they're like, oh, those little figurines. Like, no. You're starting to progress in here. Similar. I bought it short.
Rob Lee: So thank you. And obviously this is our second conversation. So thinking about your work now as we're in 2025, we did our initial conversation a couple of years ago, 2023. So what's something about your work today that would surprise the 2023 version of yourself?
Ara Koh: I would say that I'm more surprised that my work hasn't changed that much. And I'm keeping on to that research trajectory that is kind of interesting for me. I think previously, because I was in my undergrad, grad school, and those are the times when your work rapidly changes every single month. And coming now, I'm surprised that I kept that research trajectory ever since I graduated. Like, I think like since 2021, I feel like I'm going into similar trajectory and just like researching the same interest that I've been having, like, which is like digging around the D.A .V.
area. And I've went to like multiple residencies in like Tennessee, New York, Massachusetts. And soon I'm heading to Vermont and I've been driving those to those places and I've been stopping every hour and digging clay.
So that's been really fun. And just like studying what clay could do and what that does to my practice is really interesting. I think that that curiosity of clay is just like keeping it going, honestly.
Rob Lee: So this is the this is the observation that comes from what you just said. I'm curious around some of the maybe some of the thoughts that you have, you know, because that curiosity you're touching on some of the thoughts that you have when you're you're driving, when you're on the road.
There's a stillness that's there, right? So when I come down here, we're in D.C. we're eating the hotel. Yeah, yeah.
Shout out. I generally take the train down here and I guess you could probably see I have my notepad out and I get lost. I get questions because I'm not engaged fully and then something else pops up. So what are you sort of like thinking about?
You know, you're like, you know, I'm going to go right here. I want to check out to see if there's with this clay situation is here when you're on the road to like going to a Vermont going up north, going to Massachusetts or New York.
Ara Koh: Well, number one, I hate driving. I commute everywhere. I live in Northern Virginia. I drive to American University. I drive to Micah and Baltimore. It's a hike every time and I think everybody thinks that Maryland drivers, Virginia drivers, D.C. drivers, so far. I feel like everybody's stuck and I don't like driving. So I think when I'm driving, I try to unplug myself and just try to think not not think about like clay or how big of a grandeur landscape that I'm like driving into. I just try to think about like my daily stuff that like, oh, yeah, I'm getting dinner after this or oh, yeah, I forgot that I have to like do this after or like, okay, I'll go to the gym after or maybe I should do like day today.
Like things like that instead of like, oh, like I'm going to declare right here right there. But I think I think a little bit more before driving about how strategic I could be with like the clay digging part. So I would like know my route through Google Maps and stuff. And then I would like pinpoint stuff like, okay, this could be my rest stop and dig. This could be my actual like get lunch and also dig spots. So like I would pinpoint all the spots before I hit the road. So I try to not think as much as possible.
Rob Lee: Could you already have the strategy there? I'm hearing this. I'm hearing this. So what is the, because I'm so curious about this because like rest, I don't rest at all. I'm just going to go completely through. So what is the final indicator or is that something that's in the research that this is a spot that likely is going to have like some clay or something for me to kind of, for you to kind of check out?
Ara Koh: Yeah, somewhere near river would be a good spot because river means like physical corrosion. So I could dig a little deeper than just like digging like in a plain site. So that'd be a little easier for me. If there's a construction site, it's easy because they already dug stuff and I could like bring a bucket and like, Hey, can you fill them up? So those are the spots. I think like construction sites, I don't know if there's a construction or not on the map. So it's kind of like a sudden thing, but it's it's near the spot. Let's say I have like 10 minutes left or like I'm a five minutes past and they have a construction spot. Then yeah, I'll go there.
Rob Lee: I guess for whatever reason, how does visual view kind of like sneaking into a construction site like after hours? You know, got clay?
Ara Koh: You know, I'm not that sketchy. I'm all from any sketchy stuff like national park digging like no, no, no.
Rob Lee: I mean, I'm sketchy. It's like, no, don't say that. So talk a bit about your influences from your parents. I see like design as a part of the background. They're growing up in a creative and design oriented household. How did these sort of disciplines and form like how you go about your work, whether it be from form, structure or repetition in your own work?
Ara Koh: Yeah, so I was thinking about that because in the US you have Mother's Day and Father's Day, but in Korea we have parents day. And that was like earlier this month. And when I was younger, I hated my parents jobs because they're like working around the clock. They really have nine to five, which I didn't even know because back then I thought everyone's parents works like that.
So I was like, oh, my mom and dad has never had free time. They're always working around the clock. And I think that influenced me a lot that I'm working around the clock. Sort of like a workaholic. I think it works out because I teach and I have to have my own practice and then my personal life as well.
So it's good to like teeter-totter between all that. And the biggest thing I learned from my parents is the dedication to their craft, their designs. And they're still working as designers and they're just like killing it in their field. And I'm so proud of them, but also they're so hardworking. I think that's the biggest thing more than like them influencing me about like how I should build my work or like get inspired from stuff.
I think more of like the aesthetics and stuff for coming from my grandma, who is also a painter. So my grandma raised me because both my parents were so busy. So in the daytime, I would be with my grandma and then my mom and dad would pick me up after I fall asleep.
So I was with them, but not really what I'm doing. So my grandma would take me to like Monet exhibition because she was a big fan of Monet. And like all that type of stuff and I would like just jump around her when she's like painting and she does like Korean calligraphy. And it's really cool. So I think she influenced me a lot with like the aesthetics and the stuff that I find appealing as well.
Rob Lee: That's good. That's good to see. I think having those early influences, whether it be direct or indirect, has bearing on support in there. Like I've been thinking more about my grandmother, she's passed, but my grandmother's birthday would have been like last week. And as you remember, and I've said this in this podcast a lot recently, that she was a mender and you know seamstress and all of this stuff. But she was always very, she had a son who was one of my uncles who never met him past before I was born. But he was an artist.
He was doing like large scale commercial stuff, what have you. And when I took an interest in art, it's just like kind of like, all right, let's give this nudge. And I was interested in my illustration and things of that nature. So we had this old bag that ended up becoming like the bag to have my art supplies in it. You know, I would carry around and so she got this bag and damaged it and she's like, I'm going to mend this. I'm going to fix this and that's still my bag. Oh, till this day.
Rob Lee: It's in the studio currently. That's so cool. We're here. Not here. I'm here at the home studio. And but yeah, and I go back in there on occasion. It has like some of our old sketches and comic book that I did when I was in middle school. Oh, that's so sweet. And I was just like, wow, this is this is something. And then sort of the other elements from,
Rob Lee: you know, my my current just mostly my dad when it comes to sort of the work ethic component and the maybe some of the social skills from my mom or my corroded social skills. But some of the social skills from my mom, but the work ethic definitely from my dad of you're going to get out of these cities.
Ex military, right? So it's just like getting up early and start the day, get this thing rolling. And then as he's gotten older, say, ah, we got to work smart, not as hard.
So figuring out ways to develop systems and instead of, hey, I just can go through and, you know, probably 2020 right into 2022. I was averaging like an interview a day. I was just kind of recording on average and not a thing anymore. That's that's that's that's done. So figuring out different ways to still get the satisfaction and the output and the type of conversations I want, but maybe not at that same volume and just kind of cleaning up the process.
Of recording and sort of the post production and all that that comes purely from him. Like I got this route for this job. I don't know if I want to work eight hours. The thing is going to be more like six, but I'm going to get eight hours worth of work done.
Ara Koh: Oh yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah, productive grind then survive.
Rob Lee: I like it. I like it. So moving moving into sort of current studio practice and I know that you were touching on sort of that balance and that teeter tottering of it all of like personal studio.
Yeah. Teaching all of these protein shakes all of these different things at the point that out. What are the ideas that are questions that are currently like driving your work these days?
Ara Koh: I think it's probably my new body of work where I've been like layering clay on top of each other. I've been doing so I read this book in 2022 2021. It's a book called the time of earth. It's written by a Japanese geologist.
I read it in Korean so it might not be available here. But it basically what he's saying is he's like in the beginning of earth, everything all clay looked the same. But then climate over the time over time and like chemical or physical erosions happened and organisms decompose into the earth and it changes the color of the clay.
And now it looks like that. And I thought, wow, so the colors of clay that looks like it now is millions and billions of years accumulated over time. And I'm just literally digging up clay and using that.
And I thought that was like the coolest thing ever. And what I wanted to do was I kind of wanted to make my own clay, like my own version of like erosion and stuff. So I started not having an easel, not having like a background to paint on. I would just have like a wooden board or like a plank up against the wall and I would pour clay every day, dry for a day, pour clay, dry for a day.
So it's like one mayor needs two days and I've been like doing that like 60, 30, like 100 layers and I've been doing that over time. And because clay cracks, some of them fall off. Even if it falls off, I just pour more, pour more, pour more. And that's been so intriguing in my life that I wake up and I'm like, oh my God, where did it crack? And I just run. And when I'm in my living room, I hear some like plastic crackling sound. I'm like clay drop, clay drop.
I gotta go, I gotta go check. And yeah, it's been really fun to work on that. I think next week I'm heading to Vermont Studio Center for a residency. I'll be working on a different body of work there, but until I go, I think I want to finish up on that project that I've been working on.
So that's been like my driving force. And it's honestly working out because it doesn't need that much physical time in the studio. It needs a lot of drying time and just like a lot of space because I hopped in and out of Baltimore, DC, Virginia. Like, I don't have much like a big chunk of studio time for myself.
So I just checked in with my painting in the morning, see if it's dry or not, and then pour another layer that takes about like what, like 30 minutes. And then I could go teach. So yeah, I think that practice has been working out effectively time wise, but also teaching on my curiosity as well.
Rob Lee: I like that. I'm seeing that little ASMR for the clay drop.
Speaker 4: Oh, clay drop. Clay drop. And then it's not the same, but I think you'll appreciate this because you're a little fitness person. You know, it's still the thing where
Rob Lee: if it's a priority, you'll figure out a way to fit it in. So it's like, this is something creatively that you're curious in. And it's like you have these constraints, these structures of like, I got this time I'm going from this point to this point to this point and doing so many things. It's like half an hour. I can go back in and, you know, check the status of my work.
Hey, how you doing work? You fall off. Okay, you do it. And then, you know, head back to sort of the next thing and make that the thing. It's like the comparison I'm making here. It's like when someone's like, I don't have time for a workout.
You got 15 minutes. You could run, you know, or what have you. It's sort of if it's important and it's something that you enjoy, you just figure out a way to do it regardless of how much time you might have.
Ara Koh: Yeah, I mean, for me, it's the biggest, the hardest thing that the hardest thing and the biggest difference that changed my life recently. Or like in like the last two, three years was fitness that I noticed that up until grad school or like, until I graduated, I had no personal time. All the time I had was dedicated to art.
Everything I had, like reading time, it's all about like art books. And I think I went on a date and the guy asked me like, oh, where have you traveled? And I was like, oh, Korea, US, China, Japan, Canada. He's like, oh, like, what'd you do? And like, oh, I went for a residency. I was in school.
I went to the men and like everything was like art related. And I noticed that I never had time for myself. And I think till school, it was fine because like, I'm still a student. Students should really study and research.
But after graduating, I had a biggest burnout because I had no life. It was just art. And I've noticed that as a full-time artist, I work throughout the day because my work needs a lot of physical time and repetition. For one piece of work, I would pour like a month or two months worth of time.
And if I don't like the work, that two months just like completely wasted. And I saw like, oh my God, what happened to all my time? And so somebody suggested that I should go do yoga for a meditation. And I think the meditations really worked for me. I already think a lot. And it's just like the yoga instructor saying like, oh, empty your head. I can't. I can't.
Rob Lee: Just like empty it. Oh, my cool stuff is in there.
Ara Koh: And thankfully, the yoga studio that I went to had hot yoga, which you can't really think when you're doing that because it's so damn hot. And I realized like, oh, I actually like sweating. And after I do that and I come home, even if my work didn't go well, I still had something that I like, oh, I achieved something today. I went to hot yoga.
That was really hard. So I started working out because of that, that like I want to go work out so that I feel at least like a little bit fulfilled that I like check the box per day. I have a regimen even if my art doesn't work today, it will work tomorrow. I love that.
Yeah, that's been like helping my physical, physical and mental health, but also it's like it's being like a backbone for my studio practice now that I have to work out so that I can maintain my studio practice as well. Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Lee: Yeah, I find and you know, probably to come up on two years of very consistent and maybe over consistent. And we're talking five, maybe six days a week of lifting that I've been doing and sort of the early wins. Some of it, you know, some of the fitness discourse online, like I can't keep all of this. Some of this is not yes, but you sort of figure it out and you get curious about it. You explore it and you know, I kind of believe in sort of the repetition. And I think, you know, doing that every day or doing that week to week, you start building up this sort of body of, oh, I can lift this now.
I can curl this or I can run this far, whatever the thing might be. And you build confidence in that. But then also you sort of build, I think you were touching on it.
This sort of the sense of early wind sense is like, I got up, was able to knock this out. I completed this. Yeah, yeah.
This is great. And I get really early to get my stuff in. Sometimes I'm like, now it's getting a little bright because of the time of the year it is. But there's a few times like I go over to the Patterson Park right now in my neck of the woods. And I was like, a little too dark out here. I feel like goblins over here in the park.
I'm not going to run through here. Yeah, put a little little headlight on, you know. Yeah. But I think going back to sort of the repetition thing, I think art and even fitness, but art in this instance, requires like repetition. I think learning sort of the rules.
And then you figure out how to break them. You know, like, no, this is my version of this rule. It's like, I know how to do this. Like, I know how to get audio, how I choose to edit it and what I choose to do with it is, you know, style or have you. Can you walk me through like a piece or series that you had to unlearn something that you were told, this is the rule. This is how you do this. You're like, well, this is my rule.
Ara Koh: Oh, yeah, a lot of stuff. Honestly, I think I feel that even more because when I'm teaching, I have to teach them like the OG way, the basic way, the most fundamental way. In order for me to teach something, I have to really know it so that whatever question comes at me, I should be ready to answer.
And also, I want to know all the questions and explain all the answers even before they ask them. So, for example, when I'm explaining firing to my students, I have like a very quick slide that I show them before we actually go to the kiln and fire stuff together. I start with like a little gif of elbow and hell and like try to explain how the firing goes. And after explaining everything, I go back to my studio and think about my practice and think about like how unorthodox that is. Like I talk about like, oh, you should fire at this temperature first and then you do the second firing at this temperature. But for my own work, I just go to like somewhere in between and just like fuck it.
So that's one thing. Or for my clay painting practice, people think it's fired, but it's really not. People think it's fired, I think, because it looks like a tile or like I'm coming from like a ceramics background, so people expect that it's fired. And they ask me like, how'd you fire it?
And I'm like, it's not fired. And I mean, technically it could be fired because it is clay, but it won't retain its shape. And in order for clay to stay its shape, I had to do a lot of experiments with like, what do I add to clay to make it like bond to the board or whatever. So I had to research a lot of mediums. I started researching from the glaze ingredients that we put into clay to aid sticking.
But later I found out that this won't do. I have to look at like different mediums outside ceramics. So I started adding stuff that are not really supposed to go into clay. And I think I had really, maybe I was tired. In grad school, I wanted to make like the fluffiest clay, lightweight clay, and I started adding like shaving foam into it.
So it didn't work. If anybody is listening to this, learning how to do clay, don't do it. I had a shaving foam.
Like the answers are somewhere else. I ended up using perlite for that. But you just have to do a lot of experiments and knowing how to break the rules, but also not being scared to break the rules to do something else. But I think it's only doable when you know the actual way, the real way of doing it or like the most traditional way. Like that's why we teach students drawing, like whatever their major is, they have to go through drawing class to go graduate with a BFA or BA degree. And it's like the most fundamental thing. If you don't know how to communicate visually with someone else, whatever your medium is, graphic design, animation, ceramics, sculpture, painting, whatever it is.
If you don't know how to draw and you're a visual artist, you can't do a thing. So I think my grad school, Offer University, was very rigorous for critiques, but also they were very rigorous about like how to develop our work scientifically and engineering parts. So we collaborated with engineers to figure out a way to solve a problem. Like for example, one of the grad school, I wanted to make this clay, raw clay insulation that would never dry. And I talked to Dr. Bill Cardi, who was the head of engineering, and he suggested that I should coat clay with isomalt solution. So basically, candied by the clay. And I was like, this is so cool. This is clay candy, which you can't eat until you'll die very slowly. But I thought...
Rob Lee: You said that very, very cutely, by the way.
Ara Koh: But that was the coolest thing. And like it's really, really fun to break the rules by knowing more about what the material could do.
Rob Lee: That's good. I think I have to apply that into the sort of education thing. I've been podcasting for nearly two decades, which... But when I talk to folks who are new in it and they have an idea or a sense of maybe something they've listened to and not know what goes into it and what the material is. So you edit as you go along, so you save yourself time on the back end. So maybe changing your questions, maybe putting stuff in there, maybe omitting stuff as you go along.
I do that all the time. And some folks, they stick specifically to the questions. They don't improvise, they don't freestyle. I mean, you hear, they're not even listening to the guests.
Speaker 4: They're doing an interview because they will just ask the same question in a different way later, even though it's already been answered, maybe in a previous response. And so I try to share some of these different things. It's like, it's going to save you time on the back end doing, and that comes from sort of my background and data.
It's like, put the work in, doled, heavy in the beginning, and then on the back end, you can replicate this, turn this into a system, this sort of strategy. But when it comes down to the specific editing approach, I say, ah, editing's more, it's more skills more up to you than a specific science. And I like, I like cooking, right? And I think you're, you do some cooking. Yeah, I do.
Yeah, I do. And I find like, I can't bake. I can't bake at all. And I find like cooking for me, it feels like improvisational, whereas baking feels very specific because it's chemistry.
Ara Koh: It is. It is. I love baking too. It's kind of similar to ceramics.
Rob Lee: That's why I was kind of like throwing it out there for you.
Speaker 4: I was trying to be a little segue guy, you know?
Ara Koh: Yes, it's really similar. Like baking you follow a specific recipe and once you know the basic way how to bake a cookie, how to bake a cake, you could add a little, your own flair to it. Like you basically know how to make a quick yellow cake. You could add matcha. It could make like a matcha cake. And it like all depends on like the basic recipe, which is similar in ceramics where you have a basic clay body or you have a basic glaze recipe and then you want this material to do certain stuff for you. You have to know what ingredient in this glaze is doing certain things and then you have to tweak it by knowing the chemistry behind it. Yes.
Rob Lee: This means more baking soda and more baking powder. What have you?
Ara Koh: Yeah, yeah. And it's just like, oh, like I want this glaze to bubble up. Okay. Let's add some silicon carbide to it. Let's see how much it bubbles up. Try it in the pest kiln and then like if it melts too much, okay, down the silica and down the flux.
You try finessing all that. And those could only be achieved through knowing the glaze chemistry and how knowing how the, we call this UMF, unity molecular formula, which is like chemical analysis of like how much clay, how much glass, how much filler or how much flux is in there. It goes out to clay body or glazes, all surrounding materials and seeing if it fits into this chart called the salt chart or some sort of getting too nerdy, but... Nerdy is good.
But basically you have to know all that in order for you to move the piece or move the glaze or clay body that you're working with on the chart to see how this will perform before making a big mess.
Rob Lee: Gotcha. Gotcha. And because of the time component that goes in, you want to make sure you have those things in mind.
Ara Koh: Or you just do like multiple iterations at the same time.
Rob Lee: That makes sense. Yeah. I think about that in doing this. Like I had this before you got here, like some generally, I'm recording in the home studio if all of my stuff is preset, I know what it is.
No one else is touching it. Unless it's me, I'm like fleet walking. Ah, I got to switch the podcast around. It should be wild. So when I'm going into a different environment, I'm like, all right, let me get some room tone. Let me get a sense of what this is and start thinking through on the back end because I don't have a mixer with me. I can't change the reverb. I can't add gain to your mic or take something off of mine. So I'm like putting in notes like this was, you know, in this environment. I've recorded in this environment several times, but it's a different guest, right?
So the things that I needed to sweeten your voice or to maybe sour my voice, I don't know. They're different based on the sort of timing and the environment. So when I put this on and got some room tone, I was like, all right, this is going to work sometimes. You can just hear something bleed in. You're like, I can't even use that.
Okay. And then sort of the iterative nature of it, which I didn't do last week when we were going over a chord initially, always having that backup because this file could get corrupted for sake of argument. So having that backup sort of tool to capture it.
And it's like between the two, let's say if you just doesn't get corrupted, you have both send it to the editors, like which one has the best quality already. So obviously, and I think you touched on this a little bit as far as being involved in fitness, banging these weights. I know you over there bent in like 250. I think a little leg press action.
I got you squatting 500. No, no, then the quit physicality though. And like a lot of artists, you know, have like this physical work, especially when you're doing something a certain scale and just even moving the materials at times. Like how did you what?
You're five one. So the physicality is related to you making your work. Do you consider like the physical component being like part of the sort of meaning of like there was, you know, sort of this extra labor component that went into it? Or is it more so the work finished is what the meaning is the process. No one's really seen it. The process is for you.
Ara Koh: I mean, they don't have to see it. Honestly, I don't mind doing the labor. I somebody asked me recently like, oh, it must be so nice doing what you love. And I was like, oh my God, do I love art? Do I really love art? And I had a conversation with my mom like, I already know if I love this. Like is was that ever a problem to you? And we had a conversation and then I asked myself, well, I think I don't love it, but I don't think I could live without it.
So maybe that means I love it. So I don't mind doing the labor. I think the biggest labor that I really would not like to do is driving.
This minus driving, everything is tolerable. I think lifting like 50 pound buys. It's fine. 250. 250.
Just 50 pound bags because like all the clay materials come in like 50 pound bags, but nowadays I dig my own clay. So I don't even have to do that. It's just I live on the second floor. So I just have to haul that up to the up to home studio. So that's the hardest part. But nothing's that hard to me that I so to answer your question, I don't really mind people seeing my labor or not. But because my work does look labor intensive, I think either way it comes out and visually it shows. But also when people hear like, oh, I layer clay once every two days, they're like, you did how many?
I think those those things that are just like routine to me built up over time. It's kind of like you go to Grand Canyon. I've never been to Grand Canyon, but like you go to Grand Canyon and you see this like magnificent, magnificent landscapes like ground you.
You're kind of like, wow, this is like more than it's cool. This is like millions of years built up over time. And there is a sense where only that type of time or not dedication.
It's like just built up over time could surprise you or bring you to a different place like mentally. And I mean, my work is mimicking that it's nowhere close to any of that. But I think so because of that reason, like I don't feel the need for them to know my hard work. Like this is my job. Everybody does hard jobs. Like my mom is a fashion designer. She works really hard to like bring her projects come to life.
And I'm a ceramic artist. I dig, I do stuff, I list stuff, I mix stuff like that's that's what it's supposed to be. And the work should show not not like me asking them to know my hard work.
Rob Lee: Yeah, it's like when like if I do this there is work that goes into it. I would have would hope people recognize that there's research that goes into it. There's questions, there's intent and all of these different things. But as you're touching on, this is just like sort of normal for me.
Sometimes it might be a little bit more volume than I'm accustomed to do. It might be like, oh, I got six interviews today, you know, versus I got one, I put my attention in time there, but I will say this when I put those episodes out, I don't say, oh, I put seven hours of research and editing and all of that stuff into each episode. Who cares? You know, I care. And I think to the sort of point of it, it's just like the person receiving it, do they see the quality or what have you.
So it's sort of macro way to describe it that goes into it, you know, because I think when you start adding in specifically for this, you start adding in time or what the cost was to it. Right. He took seven hours to do that. You could have did more with that seven hours or you wasted seven hours.
What have you. So I'd rather keep it out and just know that I'm putting in the work, whatever that might be. So I could almost imagine someone going to a gallery and seeing some work and it's like, yes, this was done during this time.
Great. This was a body of work that was produced during this period of time. But I don't think the amount of time that went into it, people need to know because there's a lot of sort of indirect labor, if you will, sort of the thinking. I know there's this sort of bit and folks would talk about like, that's process right there.
Like you want to dinner. Like, well, that's process. I was thinking about my work.
I do the same thing. Like, I'm like, this off. Let's see. Let's see. Let's see. Let's see.
Let's see. You were touching a little bit of being loving it versus, yeah, you know, sort of that talk about that, that rigor and kind of just being captivated and committed to your work and to your process, maybe just macroly speaking, that creative act of like, this is why I'm doing this. It's why I keep doing this. It's hard sometimes. Maybe things don't work out the way that I want in the timing that I want. But what is behind, I guess, that love you were touching on?
Ara Koh: You know, I really want to know that. I'm really genuinely curious what's driving me. I guess I was kind of born into a family where I was destined to be in the arts industry. My parents are designers. My grandma raised me as a painter. My dad's side, all his sisters went to art school. And I think as soon as I was born, everybody must have thought this girl's going to go to art school. And I never really had an urge to go to an art school. Like in Korea, you could go to like art middle school or high school.
I've never done any of that. I think like one day in high school, I just realized, I think I want to go to art school. And my parents didn't really have much opposition to it. They were just like, don't do what I do, which is my mom's fashion design, my dad's art design. So like, except for that, do whatever you want. And I went into ceramics because my dad's friend suggested ceramics has future. And which I'm still unsure.
Rob Lee: You were right about that one. My undergrad had both ceramics and glass melted into one major. And in Korea, you have to be a clear major before you get accepted. So I was like, oh, like, I'll like either one of them. And I got into it.
Ara Koh: And I think I really enjoyed studying up into high school, just like all academics. And then finally, people teaching you what you like, like art history and criticism and how to talk about art, like how to make art, all the techniques and all that. It was just so cool that I took extra studio classes compared to other students. And I was like, this is gold.
I have missed any of these. And I think all the extra credit classes that I have to fill up, I filled it up with art history classes because these were just like, the classes were so much fun to me, honestly. Like this sounds so much like a nerd. And I just love that the stuff that I always wanted to learn was available. So I think that's the moment where I like loved what I did. But after graduating and this becoming your like, basically you have to make your art prove it to other people and that makes your living like that paying your rent, that paying your groceries. That became a lot of pressure to me.
But even till then, I don't hate it. It's just, I feel like when I go visit my family in Korea, I don't have a studio. I don't have anywhere to work with clay, but I still dug clay somehow. And I was processing clay in the bathroom and I asked my mom, like, I need the biggest pot you could find.
And just, I was making like, leaving with paper, thinking that this would feed into my other practice. And I wasn't able to help my hand. My hand had to do something. And I noticed that maybe I just can't rest.
I just can't take a break. But I think that fuels my work a lot. Like when I'm home alone, I have to do something and most likely and usually it is my practice. And I feel like all the media that I consume, like watching YouTube, looking at Instagram or like looking at other people's work outside and like going to the galleries and stuff, feeds into my brain.
And then it somehow spits out through my work. And that I just learned that this is coming from my parents too. Like when we go for a vacation, we will go to like art museums or like my mom would go shopping, which is like going to like other clothing stores and like her getting ideas and inspirations from it. And my dad taking pictures of the stuff that he found useful or designs that he thinks that he could improve.
And then we sit down at a coffee house and my dad would like sketch really fast on a napkin. Like those type of moments, I think gets reflected on me. That's their type of dedication. And I think that's fed into me that even if I have a free time, I can't like use it like that. So I kind of have to force myself to make personal time. That's why I felt like the gym was very useful because when you're at the gym, you can't really do much else than work out.
I mean, you could socialize, but like you can socialize much. And yeah, like maybe I picked up on Pickleball, which was really fun. People think that it's like an old people sport and I suck because I am not athletic person. I haven't worked out or like I never like sports. I like watching sports, but I never played anything growing up.
So I my hand-eye coordination is the worst. I'm like so glad I'm hitting the ball now. And it's it, but it's really fun. Like I'm really excited that I'm putting myself out there that back to the stuff that I'm not used to. And using my hand and body in a way that I'm not used to.
And I don't know, maybe not supposed to, but it's great. It's a great feeling to feel like tomorrow live. And I think using my body in that sense is helping my studio work as well. It's kind of like feeding it in and even thinking like that.
It's making me feel like, oh my God, like my art is like, everything about my life, but it's being helpful and like meeting new people. And the pickleball is like a very social sport. You have to have four, at least two people to play.
You hit the ball, someone has to bounce it back. So because most of the time when I make work until I have a show, I don't really have a response. Like I could show it to the gallery that I worked with. I could show it to my friends, but it's hard to get a response about your work. Your friends could say, oh, it looks cool. But you don't really get an in-depth conversation about what your work is like or where your work is heading, the trajectory of where it is going to. And it's good to have a quick response. Yeah, that's good.
Rob Lee: I want to go back to one of the things that really stuck out. Actually, I think you got all of my questions. So I'm going to hit you with a rapid five ones after this sort of comment. But yeah, I think, you know, I'm very curious about sort of the consulting side, creative direction. Like I think I have pretty decent taste.
Rob Lee: Yeah, you know.
Rob Lee: Thank you. That's really great. But you know, I see things and it's almost snarky, but I see things. I'm like, let me fix this for you. That's the way I look at somebody's thing when it kind of like falls short. And something that's out of my depth, I'm not so egocentric that I can say like, oh yeah, well, this is the way you screw that.
I was like, well, maybe that's your intent. But there's something that's in my wheelhouse. Like I'm really big into movies. I know what goes into making a movie. I know all the ins and outs, but in terms of a story component of a movie, because this is facilitated storytelling, I'm like, this is where you went wrong. Maybe you should have done a little bit more of this. And I'm looking at, because of the observation, I'm sitting there with like a notepad like this, writing down, not sketching, but writing down maybe four or five observations on how to take maybe a movie or project or even if it's a podcast from maybe something that was okay to, oh, this is really good.
This is to a sort of another level. And I seek out those things. And I think in part, that was the thinking I wanted to some of the guests that I booked for this next round of interviews. I'm like, hmm, wasn't really good at one or I feel like there's more to dig. There's more clay to dig up in the conversation.
Rob Lee: That's fun. I tried. I was leaving it out there for you. I was like, you're going to get it. You're going to grab it. So that's kind of what goes into it and the thinking that's there.
Rob Lee: So if you will, I got four rapid fire questions for you. And I'll give you the preamble, whatever the quickest response is you got for it. Okay. So in your travels, you talked about it, you know, here, Korea, and D.C. All that. What's the dream location that you haven't shown any work in?
Rob Lee: I haven't shown any work in. Yeah.
Rob Lee: Like, you know, like you've been to these different places, you've shown work in these different locations or have you, but what's the place you're like, I really want to show some of my work here, but you haven't done it yet. Mass Mocha. Huh? I'm not a Mass Mocha now. Next.
Ara Koh: No, no, no questions asked. Just Mass Mocha. It's been a dream. It will be a dream. It's going to be a reality. Yeah, I will.
Rob Lee: I'm going to spam them. I'm going to spam them with this interview. I'm like, she's great. Or I'll just roll up there like a giant security guard looking dude and like, hey, you know, here's the person you should check out. I'm really curious about this one, the sort of different senses that folks have, right?
So what's the scent that reminds you of home? Oh my God. I know, I know, but it's a weird one, but I think it's worthwhile. Like, like there's this thought out there. When you smell like onions being like cooked, like fries, like that's the smell of cooking. Somebody is cooking right now.
Ara Koh: Oh my God. I don't know. This might sound really odd depending on how I define home. Home, if I define where I'm at. My bed. My bed feels like home. If I define Korea, my dad's cigarette smells.
Rob Lee: Okay, okay.
Ara Koh: He quit. He said he quit, but it sometimes feels like home.
Rob Lee: I dig that. That's a weird question. It's a weird response. It won't work. No, that's good. Yeah. When I was walking over here from the train station, I was like, man, I'm getting busy. I was just smelling barbecue. I was like, what is that Korean barbecue over there? I was like, what have we got? I was like, this is amazing.
I was like, I'm not going to have any of that today, but if I stay over here too long, I'm going to. Yeah, you should. Let's see. You mentioned this earlier. So I'm curious. Cookies or cake. What is your preference and whatever the one it is, what is your favorite offset preference?
Ara Koh: I'd rather bake a cake. Okay. I don't like eating either of them. Really?
Rob Lee: That's the most disappointing part of this whole thing. I'm so upset. I'm sorry, Rafa. I have a half of it here developing. Literally, look, here, this is a clever ruse. You think we don't have for an interview. I'm here for a stop off to go get some bougie cookies after this.
Ara Koh: Oh yeah, you should. I'm going to do my lawn to get some bougie ass cookies. I was like, yo, the cookie's $5. Great. I'll take one or six. We should. Probably six. It's been $30 cookies. Yeah, why not?
Rob Lee: Oh, that's not encouraging. So here's the last one. I'm just curious from a texture standpoint, what is your preferred texture, your favorite texture, like whether it be like, I love to touch this sort of texture. I love to make work that's in this texture. What is your favorite texture? Smooth, gritty, rough, soft. What is your favorite texture? Oh my gosh.
Ara Koh: This is the hardest question, everybody. Coming up with a hit. Oh my God. Oh my God, this is so hard. I think I broke you. My favorite texture, God. You know, Wayne Kibo, the pie and the cake, the painting guy. Wayne Kibo was a guest artist when I was at Cafe Long Beach for a semester. He did an architecture and someone asked him, hey, Wayne, what's your favorite color?
Because he uses so many like pretty colors on his palette. And he said there was once with a mom who had three daughters. Three daughters asked her, mom, mom, who's your favorite daughter?
And then the mom said, I dislike you all equally. So whenever someone asks me like this type of hard question, like I say this, but I love all textures. My grad school colleague and my dear friend who was my studio neighbor for both years, Josh called me the texture girl.
And when we went to Cornell, Johnson Museum of Art for a field trip. And also to Mass Mocha, Josh called me out. He texted me, come here, come here.
And I read and he's like, this is a texture that you might like. Thanks man. Appreciate you. And I love all textures. My works are all very texturized. And I think what drew me into clay was also the texture that it could be so versatile. Was, yeah. Okay.
Rob Lee: So you got a little bit of a cop out there, but I love every night.
Ara Koh: I snuck out. I can't not.
Rob Lee: All right. So texture girl, we'll wrap up here. So I'm in the final moment. There's two things I want to do. I want to thank you for coming back on coming up from Virginia.
Ara Koh: Yeah, thank you for having me.
Rob Lee: Appreciate you for making the time and to give you the space and the opportunity to tell folks what you have coming up. Social media website, all of that good stuff. The floor is yours.
Ara Koh: Yeah. Well, my website's under construction right now. But my Instagram is ara and jala co. And I guess next week I'm going to Vermont studio center for residency for three weeks. And I won the fellowship. So it's going to be great. Now they go into Korea and backed for the fall semester at Micah. So yeah, pretty exciting stuff.
Rob Lee: They have it folks. I want to again thank our co for coming back onto the podcast and running it back with me and catching up. And for our co I am Rob Lee, saying that there's art, culture and community in the round your neck of the woods. You just have to look forward.
