The Truth in This Art with Multimedia Artist Ebony DeGrace

Welcome to The Truth in His Art. I am your host, Rob Lee. Thank you for tuning into my conversations at the intersection of arts, culture, and community. Do remember to share, subscribe, leave a review, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, all of those good places where you get your podcasts. Also, there are excerpts from the podcast and full audio experience on YouTube podcasts That does exist.

And, the video portions of excerpts from the full episodes also there. And, lastly, but very important, I wanna give a big shout out and thank you to the Robert w Deutsch Foundation for supporting, us this season with this podcast. Their support we're supported by a grant that is is funding a lot of the operations here. Podcasts aren't free, and being able to get that support from, you know, Robert W. Deutsch Foundation is, is huge.

It's really important, and it's been supporting this podcast. Actually, the last 2 years has been supporting this podcast. So again, thank you. Today, I am super excited to welcome my next guest, a visionary multimedia artist with a fervent dedication to cinematography and photography. Please welcome Ebony DeGrace.

Welcome to the podcast.

Thank you so much, Rob. Thank you so much.

Yeah. Thank you for for coming on or what have you. Like, I think we initially connected on LinkedIn, and I was just like, all right. And oh, but before I forget before I forget, because I got to do this, this is customer and this podcast. There, you know, it's just a couple of things.

If people are listening, there are themes, right? Whenever I encounter an Aquarius, I always got to shout that out. And whenever I encounter someone also wearing glasses, I gotta point that out. So thank you for wearing your glasses.

Thank you. I appreciate it. Yeah. I've been wearing glasses since I was a kid, so that's all I know.

As a man approaching 40, I've been wearing glasses since I was 3, so same tribe.

Right.

So thank you for for joining me and making the time. And, before we get into the deeper, more introspective, the questions that require notes, could you share a couple of your earliest memories related to creativity, whether it be in film specifically or creativity? Is there a piece of work that sticks out for you when you when you're thinking through that?

Yeah, actually. So, some of the films that actually resonate with me, because I watched a lot of films growing up. But this is not something that's really from my early childhood, but, an over simplification of her beauty by by Terrence Nance. A love song for Natasha by Sophia Nali Allison. And this other really, really interesting film that I watched a few years ago, that was called Raw Rich.

I'm not entirely sure the person who directed. I forgot their name, but it takes place in, Congo. And also a very experimental film by Kamasi Washington called as told to God thyself. These are these films so these are the films I actually watched back in 2019 when I became more spiritually connected with my creativity as an artist. Yeah.

And, another film that actually comes to mind now that I think about it that really started it off was the film Ghost with Patrick Swayze and Whoopi Goldberg from, like, 1990. I watched that a lot as a child. Like, I I watched it so much. It it also stood out to me because it came out in the 19 nineties, which is like like the time I was born, 1990. And I think it definitely connected with me because of, like, the spirituality in it and just talking about the afterlife and the beyond.

And so a lot of my work kinda comes from that as well. I also drew a lot as a child. Mhmm. So I actually drew quite often. I actually drew on paper, but one of my favorite types of drawing was on, like, the early 2000s micro soft, paintbrush software.

It was like a nostalgia. I had to look that name up early. I couldn't remember the name of it. So, but yeah, definitely drew a lot on there. And then I also wrote a lot of short stories and poems when I was a child.

And I and then I also started like doing photography, back in middle school. So that pretty much was all of, like, the things that pretty much started my career as an artist.

Now I'm gonna start to dive a little bit deeper in some of these. You you mentioned a a few things that definitely got I have really small ears. You can't see them in this, but then my ears perked up a little bit. I've been told that it's wild. But, so creative outlets, what were some of those, like, activities?

You mentioned drawing. You mentioned having this this early interest in the in the visual in some of the movies and films you were into. Like, I know for me, I don't do that now. But when I was younger, I wanted to be a comic book artist. And, you know, I would always find just things to draw, whether it be the old wizard magazine saying I'm going to draw the cover here.

Or when I dove into this, I can remember very distinctly, probably maybe 14, when I got this small, like, microphone, like the little click, and I was a jerk. I went to City College, you know, to make that to set the stage there. I remember we were all, wrapping up our our end of year thing, right? You know, sort of, alright, you won't be here next year, bro? That sort of stuff.

And I had the little mic, and I would talk into it 3rd person style interviewing people, But because I was a nerd and I was very, very tall, I watched wrestling. It was one of the things I was into. So during that time, this is very embarrassing. I would talk like I was The Rock while I was interviewing people. I would talk in the 3rd person.

And so that's me, you know, those sort of early stages of like having the wizard and having the sort of recorder. So for you, what what was it, like, those, like, early creative or even current creative outlets and activities that, you know, you do?

So I think mainly for me, like, some of my early creative outlets like I said, definitely writing was like was like a jumping all point for me, honestly. Mhmm. I wrote a lot of, like, short stories and poems, and I was more of like a quiet kid growing up, so I was more so to myself. So I needed a way to express myself, because I really didn't talk much. And when I started to write, I realized that there was a passion for it just because it was something that was very, very, like, solid.

It was something that I can do where no one else has to see my work, but, you know, it's something that was more personal for me. So I pretty much, you know, leaned on that a lot even even as an adult where I feel like if I need to talk about something, I can just write it down. And I keep journals everywhere honestly. And sometimes it can be a lot, you know, cluttering my mind. So even when I think about my journals, I'm just like, I have a a lot of journals.

I need to figure out what I'm gonna do with them. But, you know, it's just it's just good to have those memories in place so then you can look back at yourself in a few years and say, yeah. I definitely went through that. I definitely experienced it. And, you know, I'm still moving forward, you know, even as a artist.

So and I still like I said, I still, you know, writing stories a lot in poems mainly. Right? Even at my age.

So black and white photography, when did that, like, sort of come about, and where does that play? Is that sort of the early you're working with sort of visual and working with with with sort of tools? Like I gave the example of having that handy recorder, and now I have a state of the art studio with bougie mics. So what what was what was that that portion? Where did that come along?

Oh man, I really loved that time in my life. So, this was back in middle school. I would say 7th grade. I actually was, a part of a photography program that I stayed with for many years, but there was there was this amazing guy. His name is Marshall Clark.

He's still a photographer to this day. He also runs this company, organization called Access Art. But he was a black and white photography teacher. And, he came to my school one day when I was in middle school and just pretty much talk with everybody who were possibly interested in being a part of, the program. And I was one of those people where I didn't know anything about photography, and I thought it was pretty cool.

So I was like, you know, why not? And so that pretty much stemmed from there. So didn't know anything about black and white film photography or just photography for that matter. So, I got to learn hands on, you know, as an artist, early early artist, what it means to create something by hand. This is before we had digital photography.

I mean, I was still around, but it was doing everything by hand from actually, developing your own role as a film to actually printing your your film in the dark room. So it was quite a more just like a very immersive experience for me to just be a part of it, more direct. So, and I actually still have a lot of photography from that time that I actually hold on to. It's very near and dear to me. So, but I actually, you know, sometimes I think back on it because it's such a nostalgic experience for me.

Because, you know, when I didn't have the things I have now, I can look look to photography. Black and white film photography is like the starting point for me. So sometimes I wish I can go back and do it. I mean, I definitely could. But, you know, but I I greatly appreciate, Marshall for, you know, his for his mentorship, for his expertise because he really he really created a part of myself that I didn't know I had.

So yeah.

That's great to be able to go back and and sort of revisit those those moments. It's almost a breadcrumb. It's almost this means of tapping back into the why. It may be a medium or style or application and such that, you know, like, I don't I don't do that as much, or it's not really the biggest part of my my current work, but it you can kinda tap into, like, who you work because it makes up who you are, I guess, And that sounded real hokey, but it was real. It was a real thing that came out of my mouth there.

And, yeah, like, you know, it was a podcast that I did for about 10 years. I've been doing podcasting for about 15 and 10 of those years. I did something very different from this. It was very, you know, insulated, like sort of me, my cohost, and we talked about movies and kinda, like, you know, b s, really, but we had a good time doing it, whereas this has so many other folks involved. Like, this is in my head, the way that I see it and the way that I operate with it is is somewhere in journalism, somewhere in archive work.

It's somewhere in collaborative art project. We're for free jazzing right now. And, so, yeah, it's different, but I look back at those moments, and it's like, oh, right, when I feel my most comfortable, when I'm able to kinda, like, joke and get over my stuff without being all buttoned up, that's the things that I tap back into those skills. And, you know, you remember those moments, like where the love came from, you know?

Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. I definitely have to agree with you.

So one of the things I set up earlier, was we talked about glasses and we talked about noted Aquarians. So you mentioned Terrence Nance, noted Aquarian. What do you admire about Terrence's work and, like, were there any influences? Could you could you speak on sort of that or any other sort of creative, like, role models? I would use that term for for for sake of simplicity.

Yeah. So Terrence Nance, for me, honestly so I actually, looked more into him back in 2019. Sure. And this one, I this is when I went on his spiritual creativity. And I don't know what inspired me to originally reach out or to, like, look into his work, but I started to see him kinda pop up around.

And so I started to kinda, you know, look into his work and oversimplification of her beauty was the one that really stood out to me. And, I feel like when it when it comes to Terrence Nance's work, he's very evocative. He's very much experimental, and he definitely pushes the norms of cinematic photography. You know, it's very much Afro Surrealism. And that really deeply connects with me, a lot.

And I, you know, and it's not just him that actually creates these types of works as well. It's, other other filmmakers that that actually, play into that. So even with Jen Nakuru, who's also deeply connected with with Terrence Nance, She makes a lot of, experimental style films as well. And so, I can't think of the film oh, rebirth is necessary. That was a film that I watched by her a few years ago.

That actually I believe can be found online. And so I feel like for her, her her story is more about talking about, like, the black experience. Anything that involves the black experience for me, I'm just like, all for it. So and so then for me, I also like Sofia Nally Allison, a love song for Latasha, because of the way that she tells these very deep spiritual films, that talks about, like, the life of a person who no longer is here in the in the physical space. And she kind of bends it more so with her cinematography that makes it more feel like something that's in the beyond.

And so a lot of those films really, you know, deeply resonate with me because, you know, I always tend to question reality and also the beyond, the afterlife. And it's very much like a surreal experience for me. So those are some of the films that really or artists that I should say that really deeply connect with me overall as an artist and create and helps me to create the work that I create now.

Thank you. And, almost like a natural segue, we're gonna talk about the work you create now. And see. Is there anything you have questions? So for for those who are undead, we gave this sort of like overarching with the, you know, the intro, you know, multimedia artist.

But speak a bit about your your current work. Like, what are you currently working on? What what goes into it having those influences, having that background and that interest? Talk about your current work, please.

Yes. So a lot of my current work is a combination of like realism, candidness, blended with experimental, ethereal, and surreal elements. And that I know that's a lot, you know, like a mouthful, but that's pretty much what it is for me. But a lot of my work right now comes from that. There's a film that I'm working on right now that's been in the works for about a year, and it's, you know, it's a very deeply personal film that really touches on black girls and also black women living, existing, and also what it means to memorialize, celebrate their life here and also when they are no longer here.

And so, it's something that I'm kind of keeping very close to my heart because I'm still working on in such a very much it's like a very close project that I've told some people about. And I am looking to continue on with that even after the film is long, long created because I always question life and always question what what happens once we're not here anymore. And I'm always trying to find something that that kinda keeps me focused on what is what is life about, you know, because we're here and we have to celebrate our life. And I know a lot of us have this fear of, like, you know, passing away. So it's always, you know, something for me that I'm trying to connect reality and and and also the afterlife and also celebrating our life as well.

Thank you. It's it's important, I I think, especially, you know, here. I had a recent interview where I interviewed, not noted, of course, Tanya Everett. And, she she did this TED Talk, actor, playwright, super talented, great. And she she did this TED talk about grief with, you know, and suffering a lot of inexperience and a lot of grief in a very short period of time.

And, you know, for a long time, I'm not going to act like it doesn't exist for a long time. You know, the numbers here in Baltimore, you know, as far as murders and so on were very, very high. So just sort of this concentrated notion around grief, right, around sort of like people dying in the afterlife and so on. And, you know, when I go to certain cities, you almost get a certain vibe of, like, man, people have died here. This air ghost here.

And now, and I'll bring it to this, and this is what comes out of the conversation with Tanya. We don't really talk about it. We don't really, you know, even discuss it in in art and media. And there are instances, and and I've talked with folks, folks that look like me and you, who have had a lot in a very short period of time, and it shows up in their work, whether it be the themes that they're pursuing or how they discuss things. And I remember years ago, you know, I'm aware of it.

I'm aware of people, like, you know, passing away and you've experienced loss in some way, shape, or form. But when it gets very close to home, I started questioning what reality was. That was that was the thing I was at, and it didn't help that I was reading a lot of sci fi books at the time as far as, like, Philip k Dick and questioning sort of what reality looks like and thinking, like, man, this is just one level. This is one plane, all these sort of different things. And I I think, I guess what I'm getting at, there's a lot of, I think, value in discourse around it and conversation around it, whether it be through one's work, whether it be through being in dialogue with other people, because I think we're the only people there aware of our own death and mortality, but we don't talk about it.

Yeah. Yeah. For sure. And, you know, for me, personally, I don't like to, you know, tell people or talk to a lot of people about death because I know it's such a taboo conversation. A lot of people don't really wanna hear it, because they think it's so negative, but it is the reality.

You know? And so while I'm here existing, you know, in this world, I'm more of a person that, that, that just kind of questions what what life is and question what the purpose is. And also being able to enjoy your life as much as you can, without having that fear of the inevitable. Because it's you know, people like to think that, you know, even when you're no longer here, like, you know, there's still like a spiritual aura, to you that's still here. And even if people don't believe that, there's still pictures of you.

There's still something that you've created, something that you have that people still hold on to. Just recently, I found out about a very good friend of mine who passed away, but they passed away in 2021. And I didn't know anything about their passing until this just this year. And so I had to really deal with that grief a lot because, you know, it it I feel like for me me personally, it was very much unexpected, but something that kinda had a feeling as well. But I didn't really want to address it or really want to acknowledge it because I didn't wanna believe it.

So, even during that grieving process, I had to take the time to process what I was feeling, process, you know, this person's life and celebrate their life, and also know that this was a person that was in my life that I got to know and I got to experience. And that was that was something that actually made me feel, you know, really happy. And so for me, my my piece was to create a tribute for them, and that was a part of, a project that I did just recently within a master class.

Right.

And so that made me feel really good because it wasn't just niche, you know, just experiencing this. Other people were also experiencing this as well. And one of the things that really, really made me feel good was I had I had to reach out to, you know, my friend's family. I've never talked to them. They don't know who I am until now.

And so when I told them that I was working on this project and they finally seen it, they said, you know, it's it it definitely makes them feel really good, but, you know, it's more so them knowing that he was a person that would be happy that I created this. So he's smiling down on me for creating this piece of for him, dedicated to him. And I also had another person who was an instructor, a former instructor of mine, who told me not only did your work make it into the DMA, but his work did as well. So I got to celebrate his work, my work together, and it just shows that his life and his spirit is still living on beyond beyond the physical.

That's great. That's great. Before moving to this next question, I wanna have one more comment around around that. The the the sort of notion around what the the the afterlife and all of that stuff. I'm gonna turn into one of those podcasts, but I think we were all searching for something.

And I think it's really cool that when we were having folks like yourself that are exploring that and kind of like having a statement and a conversation around that, you know, the celebration component. Right. I think of New Orleans, I think of 2nd line or how certain cultures they're like, this is how we cope with it because here in this country at times, it's like, man, that's a drag, man. I know it sucks. It's not great, but it's just like, oh, can we have a celebration of life?

It's like, nah, we can't. We need to all be in black suits and upset. I'm like, yo, I'm gonna have it written. Actually, I'm gonna have it recorded in a podcast when I peace out. Right?

That's the way I describe it. Okay. I don't call it unalive. And when I peace out, I'm like, yo, look, press the button press the play button. Yeah, though a second line Yeah, do a second line and turn me into candles or something like that.

It's just gonna get progressively weirder but it's sort of something that's different than everyone should cry or everyone should be upset. It's just like this is a sort of different thing. Make it a party. Make it make it just a a sort of different thing. But I think having more conversations around it and having work that's done really well, as you were describing, and having that that sort of period where you didn't know your your friend passed, but being able to, in many ways, to honor and memorialize it through your work, stoked.

Yeah. Thank you. I really appreciate it. I think oh, well, I actually wanna mention this last part as well. So one of the music videos that really stand out to me when I think of depth and just like the peacefulness of it, I know everybody's gonna read into it and see it differently, but my interpretation was it was from Kendrick Lamar and flying lordises never catch me.

And there was a part in the music video where it was these these 2 little kids who had passed away. And so they were in in, caskets. And everybody was at their funeral, and they were crying. Everybody was sad and grieving and mourning. But then the kids, the boy and the girl, they had came to life, but they weren't physically alive.

They were just more spiritually alive, like, in the beyond. And so they got off the caskets and they did like this little dance number that was very beautiful but also very eerie because of the contrast of them dancing while the people at the funeral are are are crying and grieving. And then, you know, as they're continuing on with their dance number, they're, you know, they're moving out of the funeral home outside and they are around a whole bunch of kids who are playing. And then they end up hopping into, one of those, funeral cars, and then they just take off and they're driving down the street and the kids are chasing after them. And so when I think about that particular visual, I think about, like, the beauty of, like, the beyond and just, like the celebration of their life.

Even though there is a lot of sadness behind it, there's still beauty in knowing that everything is going to evolve and everything will turn out to be different in terms of like the beauty of it and also just celebrating who they are and just their memory. So So that's something that really stands out to me to this day.

That's good. Thank you.

Yeah.

So having having this sort of multi hyphenate background, right, I mean, it's technically is there. Right? And, you know, cinematographer, screenwriter, everything. You don't have everything in that space. Let's talk a bit about ideation.

Like, what is that process for you when developing a new project or a new idea, a new place where you're gonna spend time?

Yeah. Sure. So, again, sometimes my ideation just comes from just a thought that that questions reality, honestly. And anything that does focus on the beyond, like the afterlife, Or for me, just any experience that just resonates with me and my personal experiences in life. But I also have ideations just from the images that I take and also from other images from other artists.

And so that's where a lot of those, those creativity juices are starting to come out and I can kind of create something from those images or even from just a thought that may come to my mind. So, I don't really have anything profound, but that's really where it comes from when it comes to that. Yeah. I'm always I'm always thinking, like, very abstractly, I guess. So, you know, I have, like, a whole bunch of ideas that I just sit on and I'll be like, oh, this is interesting.

And, you know, people always talk about shower thoughts. You know, your little me in the shower. You're like, oh my goodness. I never thought about that. So so for me, it's just anything that pretty much tests the boundaries of just reality while also incorporating surrealism or something that's just strange that people don't think of, I'm always like, Yeah, I want to get into that.

I want to tap into that.

So that's the the start of that process where, especially you mentioned earlier, the journaling, the taking of notes and having them all in these different places. I would imagine when you have those those shower thoughts, quote unquote, I'm I'm very similar in that I always have a piece of scrap paper, the the the app open on a phone or something where I'm like, that was a good question or it's an interesting insight. I wonder what this person has to say, or I might see a bumper sticker or something, and I'll generate a thought that leads to a question. So you're having, like, almost these nuggets, like, man, wonder what the afterlife would look like in this way, or was the beyond look like in that way? Is that don't Dunkin' Donuts there?

How does that work?

That is so true. Like, that's exactly what it is. And I do have to thank these these, these filmmakers, these artists that I really tie it all back to with their surrealism, like Terrence Nance, Khalil Joseph, Jenna Crew, just all of them, because that pretty much was like the starting point. When I say 2019 was like like the spiritual breakout for my creativity, I mean that because I don't even think that I recall having these types of thoughts prior. So a lot of it pretty much opened my my eyes and my mind a lot at that time for me.

So so what would you say, and this is literally a question I'm ripping off from someone else, but I've learned recently, well, relearned recently that creativity is just gentleman theft. But, what is the biggest idea you've had? You know, and I know you were touching on something you're keeping very close right here, but what's the biggest idea you've had?

So, well, besides that film, definitely, I just want to continue to just add 1, you know, to these stories about the existence of black women and black girls. I want to continue on that story because it's it's ever going, it's everlasting, it's going it's going to continue to happen. And so because I always think about that because of course me being a black woman, I just want us to have something that's going to just like memorialize us and celebrate our lives. Yeah. I think about that a lot.

So

So it's so the the sort of being the theme, the it's the sort of larger body of work is the idea, I suppose, where

it's

like I wanna you wanna build off of that.

Yeah. Yeah. And yeah. Just overall, just anything that involves, you know, just questioning life itself, questioning reality. You know, one of the things that I'm really drawn to when when it when it comes to my work as an artist is light.

Yes. So

I'm really drawn to anything that involves sunlight, natural light, even artificial light. And so a lot of my work pretty much embodies light. Anytime I come across light, you know, I either I either decide to like just revel in it or maybe I may capture it in that moment and just kinda keep it with me like a light in a bottle. So, you know, for me, it's just anything that just anything that that that makes me realize that I am alive and I'm in this moment experiencing this, that's what I wanna add to my creative work as well.

Yeah. And and that's and that's the thing. Like, this is this is a weird comparison or, I guess, comment that I'm going to make related to that. So one of the things that traumatized me as a kid was a cartoon, and it was a cartoon movie. It was Transformers.

And, for those spoiler alert, it came on 1986. I don't have to say when Optimus Prime dies, right, all of the vibrancy and color leaves his body. He goes from the normal red, white, and blue colors to gray. And it's something about that that always stuck out to me. So when you mentioned sort of light, you mentioned I I think of color, reflecting color, And I'm like, yo, this is terrible for a kid to see, but that's the way that I sort of interpreted that.

So when I look at people as, you know, maybe being unwell or kind of getting towards that the end, I'm like, yes, let's lighten you. And and that feels weird to say that and make that connection, but when I watched it, when I saw it as a kid, I believe the animators are Japanese, it it's something about that that always kinda stuck. There's a vibrancy. We can be ashy. I'm ashy.

I took a shower earlier. I'm ashy. We could we could be like that, but you still see, like, the color. You see the the liveliness, the light in one's, like, face and their body and their expressions. But once that goes, there's something that's not there anymore.

Right. Yeah. I definitely have to agree with you as well. I think for me personally, because I actually think about that a lot when it comes to life itself. You know?

I tend to think about how how life can be grim sometimes, and I don't really want to dwell on that. Like, I'm in this in this spiritual path right now in life where I'm trying to find more of a sense of enlightenment with myself because I've always questioned, you know, life, always, you know, questioned what it's like to not be here anymore. And, you know, the way I talk people think that I've experienced a lot of death in my life. I haven't. But, I always just question, you know, anytime I hear about somebody who's no longer here, like they passed away, you know, there's a there there is a moment in time where I'm sitting and I'm just reflecting and I'm just kind of being I'm kind of putting myself in that in that space.

Almost like I'm just being very empathetic to, like, being in that moment. And so I know that there's gonna be a time where, you know, things, you know, things will turn out in a way where I will not be here. But, I'm I'm trying to find a sense of peace and understanding and also just accept it. But also, like I said before, trying to focus on, like, the here and now. And so that's where my spiritual path is going.

I've actually been practicing a lot of, like, Buddhism lately, so that's been kind of been like like the path that I've been, you know, getting myself to.

And the the notion of thinking what what is the oh, it's a it's a book. It's it's, you know, it's probably me going back to business school, but thinking with the end in mind, the the sort of memorialization, the archival work with, black women and girls, like, having that is, like, this is what I'm working on. This is the direction you're gonna go. This is what your interest is, and having it as an archive. So, you know, the inevitability, as you you touched on, it's like, well, I have this.

I left this here. This is my work, and this is what my work is is has this focus towards. So that's, I mean, there's someone's gonna have all of these podcasts. I don't know what the hell they're gonna do with them, but they'll have them. But, you know, yours is gonna be of more value.

So I kind of I'm deprecating. I got 2 more real questions, and I didn't tell you before we got started. There are rapid fire questions at the end.

Alright, I'm ready.

So so these last 2, the first one goes a little bit like this. I'm curious about the how, right? So are there particular tools, methods that, 1, you know, that you utilize, like, regularly, like, you know, what's the app that you're using most often? What tool are you using most often? And is there a tool that helps you get super creative, like, that helps you with sort of, like, your workflow?

Like, a virtual assistant helps me. It's not a person. That's a person, not a tool. But for you, what what are the, the one that helps you the most, and what's the one that you use the most often in your work?

So the one that I use often in my work, unfortunately, because I don't have a website. I need to work on that. I will. I promise. It's Instagram.

So that's where all of my work, all of my current work is. And I also have a a flicker page as well. I've actually pretty much put that as like an archival space. I'm no longer going to add any photos there, just because I'm not paying a premium to do it. But, yeah, those are the main key places that I actually, you know, have most of my work.

I also have a Tumblr as well. I'm not sure if anybody, like, old school who's still using Tumblr. I've had mine since, like, 2011, so I'm not gonna get rid of it. I thought I would, but I'm not. But I use Tumblr as as, like, this, this archival space as well for me to, you know, keep some of my poems.

And so that's my online school that I use when I wanna write, you know, little, prose, poetry, anything that comes to mind. And of course, still using my journal. What else? Yeah. I think those are like the main things honestly because I try to keep everything very like very like close and, very very simplistic for me because I know how I am when it comes to a lot of, personal work.

You know, you have everything all over the place. You don't know where where anything is, especially when you have it online. You know, things can go anywhere. So I try to keep everything kind of, like, confined to, like, a little, you know, small space.

So with and thank you. So so within the the technical component, like like, what were you using in terms of, like, shooting, for instance? Are you are you Mac or Windows based? Things like that. Like, you know, I there's, like, certain gear that I use over other gear.

Like, I use not not this Zoom, but I my recording device, my mixer is a Zoom mixer. I use, Shure microphones for sake of argument. So what are you using in that regard?

So well I would say this, when it comes to cameras though, so I definitely use a Fuji camera. I really love my Fuji camera. When it comes to computers, I use a PC. I would like to get a MacBook just to see what it's about, you know. I actually got into a MacBook or actually had one recently, but, and it's actually more borrowed than anything.

And I try to get into it, but it's I've been out of the game for a while when it when it comes to MacBook. I I tell you. But I do have a iPhone, but I just don't know how to use a MacBook. Yeah. But but yes.

I'm definitely PC. When it when it comes to editing, I I would say that I use light room to edit my photos. And, when it comes to editing video, I actually use DaVinci Resolve. I just got into that just, like, maybe 2 years ago, and I just love it. I love it.

I was using Premiere Pro. It's cool, but the I think I think DaVinci is better for me personally because I get to color grade and get in there and tweak my colors and stuff, so that's also something I like to do on the side as well.

Well, I mean, Adobe ain't paying us. So I got I got one last, like, real question here, and and thank you, because that's definitely add some color color green. But definitely add some some context. You mentioned Instagram or what have you. So, you know, this is a question that's really been on my mind recently because, you know, did the podcast teaching thing and had to spend a bit more time and using social media in different ways.

So social media and big business can make it look easy in terms of content creation. Sometimes there's a balance between making art and making content. Anyone can write a book. Anyone can make a song. Doesn't mean it's good, but it can be made.

And I think Drake reminded us that anyone can just throw AI out there and fling it into the universe. This makes it, I think, harder to distinguish good from great, good from industry plant, or any of those different things. And it's in the same pool with more interesting work with with actual work of merit. Like, do you think just from your vantage point being a consumer and being an artist, do you think that we truly value creativity in today's landscape, or is it more about clicks and influence?

Well, I can only really speak for myself. I definitely value talent over anything. I know it seems like, you know, like, a lot of people now are more focused on things that can be created quickly because, you know, the way our minds process a lot of stuff, like, we just want content like now. But I do value like the steps that it takes to get to like the final destination of things. And it's not gonna just happen overnight, and it's not even gonna happen within like 10 minutes, you know, that there is there is time and grace that you have to put into your creativity.

So I'm not really for just the content creation that's just being pushed out, like, rapid fire wise. Because I've actually came across some content mainly on YouTube recently where people were just using AI voices to talk. They don't use actual voices to, like, talk about the things that they're talking about. And that really makes me sad because I wanna hear an actual person because that's that's something that you're passionate about, something that you should have some type of enjoyment in talking about, but it's just easy to just put, you know, content out there because you wanna make money off of it. And so that's something that I try to, you know, me personally, I try to, you know, stay stay far stay far away from that personally just because it's not something that I can really stand behind because I know what it takes to get to, you know, step 1, and then you get all the way to step z, you know?

It's just Yeah. There is a lot of levels to this. There's levels to this shit, you know? So I'm definitely more of a person that really prioritizes the whole brainstorming process. And and don't get me wrong, sometimes I feel that brainstorming does does definitely require a lot of brainpower, but that's why sometimes you have to just kind of take a moment to just pause, come back to it, and, you know, and just take time to just think about it without just being so quick to just put all your work out there and trying to rush your work.

So that's why a lot of my work takes time, even the film that I'm working on, because I'm such a perfectionist, and I'm not going to put anything out there that I don't feel is worthy of me or anything that just embodies what I do as an artist.

Thank you. That's very well said. And I think we're on the same page, you know, when we have these conversations on what this is, what podcasting is, it's a newer medium. It's about 20 years old or so, but it's a newer medium. So, oh, you're an influencer now.

You know, like, I try to approach what I do with some marital what have you and I have these back and forth fights. Usually, they're not with people that look like you and I, but they'll just tell me, oh, it's, you know, it's kind of like street art or it's kind of this. They'll sort of, you know, diminish it, and it's it's a very weird thing, which kinda took me on this trajectory of, well, I'm not approaching it like content. I'm not even doing it as content in that way. Sure.

There can be a piece of it that's exported as content. Like, when someone does a great painting and then they put it on social media, it's not content. It's just the artwork, and they're just putting it out there. So it's a piece of it, but you're not experiencing that painting. You're not going there seeing it in person or even when someone does like video and they have like a film.

Like, yeah, you might be to get a clip of it, but that's not the like 35 millimeter, like the sort of crisp chef kiss version of it. So it's kind of a watered down version of it, and we're already watering down something that's getting more watered down by sort of as you you put it out to sort of rapid breakneck pace of you got to get something out there 3 posts a day, make sure people like it. And I don't know. I think I think it's something in there where we we I think we value I think we value being, being captivated. I think we value our attention being occupied.

I think that's a piece of it. There are a lot of folks who rebel against that and who don't jam with that, but I think the the algorithms and all will tell you always gotta have something going out there. Otherwise, you're not doing anything. It's like, yeah, I'm working this body of work for x amount of years. Well, you're not doing anything.

I definitely have to agree with you. There was a period of time where I felt like I had to keep putting my work out there on my, Instagram a lot just because I wanted to be noticed, I wanted to be recognized for my talent, for my work. And I got to a point now where, you know, I don't post as much, but I do post when I feel compelled to or if I know that there is some work that I would like to have, you know, in this in this digital space. But there was a time where I felt like I needed to stay on top of, like, my photography and my filmmaking just so I could be recognized by other artists so they can give me my accolades, give me my flowers. But I have learned now that, you know, I have to accept who I am as a person and not to force myself to try to put work out there in order to appease anybody else.

That's not really what I want to do. And so I I actually have found more peace in just posting whenever I post because at the end of the day, I know people still like my work. I know that I like my work, and I don't have to keep proving it to anybody. You know? So this is just my way of, you know, taking a break from social media sometimes and not having to put out all this work just so I can show people, like, hey.

I'm here. You know? I just kinda just do what I do, and then I still go out and I just live my life.

Little little proof of life situation, and then I'll close on this. It's it's very similar. I did a bit of a social experiment where I just divested the amount of time I was putting out there because it turns into wallpaper. You know, you're you're you're out there. Your posts just get eaten up by sort of the deluge of of posts that are there.

So in it, you know, I was just like, well, you can't listen to the podcast on on Instagram. You You might be able to see clips of it, but that's not actually the full podcast now, is it? It's, again, a sort of watered down segment of the full thing. But if you actually wanna know what I'm doing and how things are going or keeping up with the podcast, sign off for the mailing list, maybe subscribe. You know, that's actually kinda how you get it versus, oh, you didn't post today.

So now that I'm off my soapbox, I didn't really because I'm 64, I didn't really get any lower. I'm still like you know, it looks like I'm on a soapbox, but I stepped down off of the soapbox. I wanna I wanna move into my rapid fire questions. I got 4 of these questions, and I'll and you've you've never played rapid fire before. So the way that rapid fire works is I just ask you the question, and the first thing that comes to mind, don't overthink it.

First thing that comes to mind, that's your answer. It's like, hey, I said what I said. Alright. Deal. Deal.

Alright. Cool. I heard you said deal. So here's the first one. On average, how many hours of sleep do you get?

Oh, if I had to take a wild guess, it can range from maybe 3 hours to, like, 8 hours.

Okay. So that is, 6 and a half hours on average. What is the most recent song you've played?

Oh, gosh. I just heard this song. Come Close by Carmen and, reggae blige. I love that song.

That's a good tune. I like that joint. What color this is this is great. What color matches your current mood?

Mhmm. That's a good question.

That's that's a new one I've added recently.

I'm definitely gonna go with white, for sure. Peace.

And this is the last one. And this kinda has elements of the earlier conversation. I always like to work one of these sorts sorts of things in there. And I think I know the answer, but I'm still gonna ask it.

Okay.

Are ghosts real? Yeah.

Mhmm. Mhmm.

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yeah. I was kinda really here with hot fire 1.

I personally have not seen a ghost, so I'm gonna go against it and say, I don't think that they are real.

As a person who's stayed in a room with a ghost in New Orleans, I'm gonna say that they are.

Some people all know.

I woke up I woke up, looked to the side. I was like, yo, who's in that chair? I was like, I'm in this room by myself.

My goodness. And you know what's so interesting? I'm actually gonna be going to New Orleans in, July. So

Oh, enjoy.

Oh, no.

If you're on a top floor of a hotel and no one visits the entire week to clean your room or anything.

Oh, goodness. I'm going to Airbnb. I hope that's not haunted. Oh, man.

Yeah. I'll tell you more after after we wrap. So that's kinda it, for the podcast. Thank you for enduring the rapid fire. And, in these final moments, I wanna do 2 things.

I wanna, 1, thank you for coming on and spending, you know, part of your Friday with me. And, 2, I want to invite and encourage you to share with the listeners where they can check you out, social media, all of that good stuff. The floor is yours.

Yes. Okay. So you can find me on my Instagram. That's mainly where I'll be, Ebony, e b o n y, like the mag. So it's Ebony like the magazine, but just take the magazine part out and just put mag.

You'll find me. I promise.

That's that's great. I am typing that in currently because I'm probably gonna make fun of it, but I'm writing that

right now. Because I feel like the magazine was taken, but I'm happy that it was taken because it's way too long. So I feel like the mag is where I'm going.

Okay. Documentary and storyteller. And is any any other places that you check out?

That's the main one for right now until I get this web site up, and it will be coming out soon. So stay tuned.

And there you have it, folks. I wanna again thank Ebony De Grace for coming on and sharing a bit of her journey with us on this podcast. And I'm Rob Lee saying that there's art, culture, and community in and around your neck of the woods. You've just gotta look for it.